Fanible
Administrator
Join Date: Oct 2002
I peered into the vastness and saw nothing. Felt nothing.
Posts: 19,184
Likes: 788
Location:
Last Online Nov 6, 2024 0:31:29 GMT -5
|
Post by Fanible on Mar 20, 2021 0:29:34 GMT -5
I seldom watch old 4:3 shows. The only exceptions are some comedies/sitcoms, but how those look cinematically is kind of irrelevant. You're watching it solely for the comedy and they look generally cheap anyway. Sound system and size of screen? Doesn't matter. But for a cinematic experience like this? No... just no. The 4:3 aspect ratio is stupid. You know this is the ratio that Citizen Kane, Gone With the Wind, and Casablanca was shot in, right? So because there's good movies in the format, it shouldn't bug me? That I actually should like it because of that fact? If those movies were shot today, it likely still would, regardless of how good a movie they are. For the record, I only like one of those three, and I'm not sure I own a single movie other than that one that isn't wide screen. I could be wrong, but just off the top of my head. *I was wrong. I also own Singin' in the Rain. Hey, it's fine if some of you don't mind it. Personally, it bugs me, and it will likely bug me throughout this entire movie as it has with others. It's not like this particular movie is some oddball out. The Lighthouse? Grand Budapest Hotel? There's always a few that roll along now and again and it bugs me every time. But, of course, comedies I don't mind it as much. And this isn't some new trend that I've taken to with the advent of wide screen televisions. I always preferred watching movies in their widescreen format on 4:3 televisions and hated it when they were cut to fill it up. Black bars aren't the issue. You're going to get black bars on top and bottom for many films, even with a wide screen TV. I simply believe movies look better shot in a wide angle format and presented as such. The only exception being that of IMAX film being shown on a true, traditional IMAX screen.
|
|
1godzillafan
Studio Head
Join Date: Feb 2017
I like pie!
Posts: 9,480
Likes: 6,217
Location:
Last Online Nov 8, 2024 5:42:00 GMT -5
|
Post by 1godzillafan on Mar 20, 2021 0:53:20 GMT -5
|
|
Neverending
CS! Platinum
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 65,788
Likes: 8,648
Location:
Last Online Nov 25, 2024 12:00:25 GMT -5
|
Post by Neverending on Mar 20, 2021 1:26:38 GMT -5
|
|
PG Cooper
CS! Silver
Join Date: Feb 2009
And those who tasted the bite of his sword named him...The DOOM Slayer
Posts: 16,649
Likes: 4,066
Location:
Last Online Nov 25, 2024 11:13:25 GMT -5
|
Post by PG Cooper on Mar 20, 2021 1:34:33 GMT -5
That ship has sailed. Kinda itching to rewatch Man of Steel though.
|
|
Neverending
CS! Platinum
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 65,788
Likes: 8,648
Location:
Last Online Nov 25, 2024 12:00:25 GMT -5
|
Post by Neverending on Mar 20, 2021 1:44:35 GMT -5
Kinda itching to rewatch Man of Steel though. You do you. 1godzillafan & I gonna go watch Lois & Clark.
|
|
thebtskink
CS! Silver
Join Date: Jul 2000
It puts the lotion on its skin or else it gets the hose again.
Posts: 19,462
Likes: 4,984
Location:
Last Online Nov 24, 2024 18:41:41 GMT -5
|
Post by thebtskink on Mar 20, 2021 6:01:24 GMT -5
Did they show Barry healing quickly anywhere else in the movie before the end?
As someone who has vowed never to watch any CW show, I would've appreciated something that showed that was in his skillset prior to the ending battle.
|
|
Dracula
CS! Gold
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 26,105
Likes: 5,732
Location:
Member is Online
|
Post by Dracula on Mar 20, 2021 7:49:15 GMT -5
You know this is the ratio that Citizen Kane, Gone With the Wind, and Casablanca was shot in, right? So because there's good movies in the format, it shouldn't bug me? That I actually should like it because of that fact? Kinda. I mean, it's not just those three movies, almost every movie shot before the mid 50s was in that ratio as have many made after that, filmmakers have done countless amazing things with it. On average I probably prefer the widescreen format as well and think its become the default for a reason, but there are any number of valid reasons not to use it. That's not to say that the decision to shoot in it is above criticism but to just say "on principal movies shot in this ratio suck!" strikes me as rather closed minded. Its like saying "black and white sucks" or "screw anything that doesn't have a score." Viewing movies intended for theaters at home is and always has been a compromise, you don't exactly get the immersive intent of Ben-Hur's super-wide aspect ratio when you watch it from home either but it doesn't take a lot of imagination of get what the filmmaker was going for and to imagine the effect if watched in the intended format, which is sort of what you you're supposed to do with Justice League. Seeing a movie use this format for reasons of spectacle instead of reasons of nostalgia or confinement was, to me anyway, really interesting and I would hope you could open up your mind to see it the same way.
|
|
Fanible
Administrator
Join Date: Oct 2002
I peered into the vastness and saw nothing. Felt nothing.
Posts: 19,184
Likes: 788
Location:
Last Online Nov 6, 2024 0:31:29 GMT -5
|
Post by Fanible on Mar 20, 2021 9:09:16 GMT -5
So because there's good movies in the format, it shouldn't bug me? That I actually should like it because of that fact? Kinda. Okay. Odd, but let's move along. So because there's good movies in the format, it shouldn't bug me? That I actually should like it because of that fact? I mean, it's not just those three movies, almost every movie shot before the mid 50s was in that ratio as have many made after that, filmmakers have done countless amazing things with it. On average I probably prefer the widescreen format as well and think its become the default for a reason, but there are any number of valid reasons not to use it. That's not to say that the decision to shoot in it is above criticism but to just say "on principal movies shot in this ratio suck!" strikes me as rather closed minded. Its like saying "black and white sucks" or "screw anything that doesn't have a score." Viewing movies intended for theaters at home is and always has been a compromise, you don't exactly get the immersive intent of Ben-Hur's super-wide aspect ratio when you watch it from home either but it doesn't take a lot of imagination of get what the filmmaker was going for and to imagine the effect if watched in the intended format, which is sort of what you you're supposed to do with Justice League. Seeing a movie use this format for reasons of spectacle instead of reasons of nostalgia or confinement was, to me anyway, really interesting and I would hope you could open up your mind to see it the same way. Fair enough, however I don't recall saying any media in that format automatically sucks. On the contrary. You literally just quoted me saying "there are good movies". More to the point is that I believe it's evolved. The choice to move to wide screen formats was a wise choice. So yes, it will bug me when it is attempted to be done today. I cannot think of any permanently made, present day movies in the format that make me think "This movie needed it. The director's vision would have been compromised had it not been". You know, other than for nostalgia's sake. Some of WandaVision's episodes were 4:3 for this reason. Would have drove me crazy if the entire series was that way. All of this stemmed from the sentiment of "I watch old 4:3 a lot so I'm used to it so whatevs". However we would be having this same conversation if Snyder decided to make this movie black and white (which I think he wanted) or a silent film, because it was his "vision". Either of those artistic directions also would have bugged me. But sure, let's start naming classic b&w and silent films because I said I have a preference to watch my media in color and with sound. Ben-Hur is an odd example, if you read what I wrote. As I already said, the black bars are not the issue. I believe the wide angle format is the superior way to capture and view media. It has never bothered me to have black bars on top and bottom. Ben-Hur looks fantastic. Sure, I'm all for discussing the interest in how and why the Snyder Cut was shot the way it was, but that doesn't lessen the fact that it lessens a modern film for me as a result and I don't care for it having been shot that way. Just as I also didn't care for the Grand Budapest Hotel or The Lighthouse being shot that way, despite enjoying them both. You can indeed call me out on a lack of imagination, which is also fair enough. I have trouble reading full novels in a decent amount of time. It takes me a very long time to finish books.
|
|
Fanible
Administrator
Join Date: Oct 2002
I peered into the vastness and saw nothing. Felt nothing.
Posts: 19,184
Likes: 788
Location:
Last Online Nov 6, 2024 0:31:29 GMT -5
|
Post by Fanible on Mar 20, 2021 9:15:18 GMT -5
I do find it funny discussing this on Justice League of all movies. I'm probably not going to end up enjoying it overall anyway. But I am hoping going in with such low expectations has me coming out pleasantly surprised.
How does most of everyone stack the entirety of the DC films together by comparison? I only thought Man of Steel was okay and Batman v Superman was awful. Do you need to have a general enjoyment of those movies to be able to appreciate this one ultimately?
|
|
Dracula
CS! Gold
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 26,105
Likes: 5,732
Location:
Member is Online
|
Post by Dracula on Mar 20, 2021 9:44:29 GMT -5
Kinda. I mean, it's not just those three movies, almost every movie shot before the mid 50s was in that ratio as have many made after that, filmmakers have done countless amazing things with it. On average I probably prefer the widescreen format as well and think its become the default for a reason, but there are any number of valid reasons not to use it. That's not to say that the decision to shoot in it is above criticism but to just say "on principal movies shot in this ratio suck!" strikes me as rather closed minded. Its like saying "black and white sucks" or "screw anything that doesn't have a score." Viewing movies intended for theaters at home is and always has been a compromise, you don't exactly get the immersive intent of Ben-Hur's super-wide aspect ratio when you watch it from home either but it doesn't take a lot of imagination of get what the filmmaker was going for and to imagine the effect if watched in the intended format, which is sort of what you you're supposed to do with Justice League. Seeing a movie use this format for reasons of spectacle instead of reasons of nostalgia or confinement was, to me anyway, really interesting and I would hope you could open up your mind to see it the same way. Ben-Hur is an odd example, if you read what I wrote. As I already said, the black bars are not the issue. I believe the wide angle format is the superior way to capture and view media. It has never bothered me to have black bars on top and bottom. Ben-Hur looks fantastic. Yeah, but you had conceded "The only exception being that of IMAX film being shown on a true, traditional IMAX screen" which is exactly what Justice League was shot for, much as Ben-Hur was shot to fill some super cinerama type screen, it seems logical to me to then carry that framing over for a home video release for the same reasons you'd carry the original Ben-Hur aspect ratio.
|
|
Dracula
CS! Gold
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 26,105
Likes: 5,732
Location:
Member is Online
|
Post by Dracula on Mar 20, 2021 9:55:45 GMT -5
I do find it funny discussing this on Justice League of all movies. I'm probably not going to end up enjoying it overall anyway. But I am hoping going in with such low expectations has me coming out pleasantly surprised. How does most of everyone stack the entirety of the DC films together by comparison? I only thought Man of Steel was okay and Batman v Superman was awful. Do you need to have a general enjoyment of those movies to be able to appreciate this one ultimately? 1. Man of Steel ... 2. Snyder Cut 3. Shazam 4. Wonder Woman 5. Aquaman ... 6. Birds of Prey 7. Suicide Squad 8. Wonder Woman 1984 9. Justice League Theatrical Cut ... 10. Batman V. Superman Director's Cut 11. Batman V. Superman Theatrical cut
|
|
Fanible
Administrator
Join Date: Oct 2002
I peered into the vastness and saw nothing. Felt nothing.
Posts: 19,184
Likes: 788
Location:
Last Online Nov 6, 2024 0:31:29 GMT -5
|
Post by Fanible on Mar 20, 2021 10:34:47 GMT -5
Ben-Hur is an odd example, if you read what I wrote. As I already said, the black bars are not the issue. I believe the wide angle format is the superior way to capture and view media. It has never bothered me to have black bars on top and bottom. Ben-Hur looks fantastic. Yeah, but you had conceded "The only exception being that of IMAX film being shown on a true, traditional IMAX screen" which is exactly what Justice League was shot for, much as Ben-Hur was shot to fill some super cinerama type screen, it seems logical to me to then carry that framing over for a home video release for the same reasons you'd carry the original Ben-Hur aspect ratio. Except, again, I'm of the opinion that a wide angle format to any degree is the superior way of shooting and viewing media, regardless. Even Napoleon from 1927 (and that would have been a better example). So Ben-Hur is going to look good to me either way. IMAX is on a whole other level when it comes to needing to be viewed that way, on that type of screen. Far more so than Cinerama ever was or is, nor the film that is used. But let's get real. This is how you would need to watch a movie if you're wanting to see how it was supposed to be viewed, because it was made specifically for that type of screen, not at home. Personally I'd probably prefer not to, but I wouldn't be against trying: But even if we're not going that route, you're still talking about basically needing to take the Cinemara wide format and then also blowing it up vertically as well. It's a massive difference between the two to be able to "experience" it as it was in the theater, which is why IMAX film is only good on a traditional IMAX screen. This is your basic screen size difference between the two cinemas:
|
|
Fanible
Administrator
Join Date: Oct 2002
I peered into the vastness and saw nothing. Felt nothing.
Posts: 19,184
Likes: 788
Location:
Last Online Nov 6, 2024 0:31:29 GMT -5
|
Post by Fanible on Mar 20, 2021 10:37:22 GMT -5
I do find it funny discussing this on Justice League of all movies. I'm probably not going to end up enjoying it overall anyway. But I am hoping going in with such low expectations has me coming out pleasantly surprised. How does most of everyone stack the entirety of the DC films together by comparison? I only thought Man of Steel was okay and Batman v Superman was awful. Do you need to have a general enjoyment of those movies to be able to appreciate this one ultimately? 1. Man of Steel ... 2. Snyder Cut 3. Shazam 4. Wonder Woman 5. Aquaman ... 6. Birds of Prey 7. Suicide Squad 8. Wonder Woman 1984 9. Justice League Theatrical Cut ... 10. Batman V. Superman Director's Cut 11. Batman V. Superman Theatrical cut Okay, that actually makes a big difference, because my list is very similar, except I would put Man of Steel below Shazam. That makes it harder to go into this movie with lowered expectations.
|
|
Neverending
CS! Platinum
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 65,788
Likes: 8,648
Location:
Last Online Nov 25, 2024 12:00:25 GMT -5
|
Post by Neverending on Mar 20, 2021 10:48:37 GMT -5
The highlight of the DCEU is the one time Zack Snyder didn’t use slow motion. 1godzillafan made a valid point about the DCEU wanting to be the LOTR to Marvel’s Star Wars, but I think people just wanted these movies to be more gritty. Marvel’s success in the comics and in the MCU has been its serialization. DC’s success has mostly been its individual stories. There was never any reason for Warner Bros to try and replicate the MCU. If we get one or two Justice League movies, that’s fine, but what people want is a badass Batman movie, a cool Superman flick, etc. Which leads me back to my original point. Zack Snyder excess was never the answer. These DC movies should have been the “scaled back” alternative to Marvel. They shouldn’t have been the LOTR to Marvel’s Star Wars but the Indiana Jones to Marvel’s Star Wars.
|
|
Dracula
CS! Gold
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 26,105
Likes: 5,732
Location:
Member is Online
|
Post by Dracula on Mar 20, 2021 10:50:55 GMT -5
They shouldn’t have been the LOTR to Marvel’s Star Wars but the Indiana Jones to Marvel’s Star Wars. Maybe the Star Trek to Marvel's Star Wars is what you're going for?
|
|
Fanible
Administrator
Join Date: Oct 2002
I peered into the vastness and saw nothing. Felt nothing.
Posts: 19,184
Likes: 788
Location:
Last Online Nov 6, 2024 0:31:29 GMT -5
|
Post by Fanible on Mar 20, 2021 11:00:36 GMT -5
The highlight of the DCEU is the one time Zack Snyder didn’t use slow motion. Do we know this was actually his choice? *I guess if it remains the same in the director's cut, then it was. **Or was it?
|
|
frankyt
CS! Gold
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 21,947
Likes: 2,017
Location:
Member is Online
|
Post by frankyt on Mar 20, 2021 11:01:06 GMT -5
This was awesome in the most pretentious style over substance way possible but it also brought some solid new storylines or more clarity on existing storylines from the whedon cut.
This is the definitive cut no doubt but I am pretty disappointed we won't see more of this universe and the armada of darkseid, and that martian manhunter (at least for a while). Eisenbergs luthor is still trash tho.
I think the aspect ratio decision was was a mistake but I can get over it pretty quickly.
8/10 on the sliding genre scale
|
|
Fanible
Administrator
Join Date: Oct 2002
I peered into the vastness and saw nothing. Felt nothing.
Posts: 19,184
Likes: 788
Location:
Last Online Nov 6, 2024 0:31:29 GMT -5
|
Post by Fanible on Mar 20, 2021 11:03:40 GMT -5
They shouldn’t have been the LOTR to Marvel’s Star Wars but the Indiana Jones to Marvel’s Star Wars. Maybe the Star Trek to Marvel's Star Wars is what you're going for? I'm having trouble understanding any of those, but I would have loved it if this was literally a viable comparison. Where I could say that perhaps the DCEU was the more calculated, intelligent approach to the genre. Unfortunately...
|
|
Dracula
CS! Gold
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 26,105
Likes: 5,732
Location:
Member is Online
|
Post by Dracula on Mar 20, 2021 11:05:57 GMT -5
Maybe the Star Trek to Marvel's Star Wars is what you're going for? I'm having trouble understanding any of those, but I would have loved it if this was literally a viable comparison. Where I could say that perhaps the DCEU was the more calculated, intelligent approach to the genre. Unfortunately... Oh, I'm not making that comparison, just thinking that's what Neverending is looking for. The LOTR comparison definitely closer to what we actually got (a mythic/epic approach to the Superhero).
|
|
Fanible
Administrator
Join Date: Oct 2002
I peered into the vastness and saw nothing. Felt nothing.
Posts: 19,184
Likes: 788
Location:
Last Online Nov 6, 2024 0:31:29 GMT -5
|
Post by Fanible on Mar 20, 2021 11:08:41 GMT -5
I'm having trouble understanding any of those, but I would have loved it if this was literally a viable comparison. Where I could say that perhaps the DCEU was the more calculated, intelligent approach to the genre. Unfortunately... Oh, I'm not making that comparison, just thinking that's what Neverending is looking for. The LOTR comparison definitely closer to what we actually got (a mythic/epic approach to the Superhero). Just needs more pointy ears either way. This is the definitive cut no doubt but I am pretty disappointed we won't see more of this universe and the armada of darkseid, and that martian manhunter (at least for a while). Are we ruling out the possibility that WB might actually consider continuing off of this? It seems far too popular (95% from users on RT) for them to not consider it at all.
|
|
1godzillafan
Studio Head
Join Date: Feb 2017
I like pie!
Posts: 9,480
Likes: 6,217
Location:
Last Online Nov 8, 2024 5:42:00 GMT -5
|
Post by 1godzillafan on Mar 20, 2021 11:17:21 GMT -5
The highlight of the DCEU is the one time Zack Snyder didn’t use slow motion. 1godzillafan made a valid point about the DCEU wanting to be the LOTR to Marvel’s Star Wars, but I think people just wanted these movies to be more gritty. Marvel’s success in the comics and in the MCU has been its serialization. DC’s success has mostly been its individual stories. There was never any reason for Warner Bros to try and replicate the MCU. If we get one or two Justice League movies, that’s fine, but what people want is a badass Batman movie, a cool Superman flick, etc. Which leads me back to my original point. Zack Snyder excess was never the answer. These DC movies should have been the “scaled back” alternative to Marvel. They shouldn’t have been the LOTR to Marvel’s Star Wars but the Indiana Jones to Marvel’s Star Wars. One could argue that Indiana Jones is what they're doing right now, because they're now going for individual adventure movies that don't forward a big picture but tell a contained story that just happens to be set in one continuity.
|
|
Neverending
CS! Platinum
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 65,788
Likes: 8,648
Location:
Last Online Nov 25, 2024 12:00:25 GMT -5
|
Post by Neverending on Mar 20, 2021 11:36:35 GMT -5
Maybe the Star Trek to Marvel's Star Wars is what you're going for? Nah.
|
|
Neverending
CS! Platinum
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 65,788
Likes: 8,648
Location:
Last Online Nov 25, 2024 12:00:25 GMT -5
|
Post by Neverending on Mar 20, 2021 11:38:55 GMT -5
One could argue that Indiana Jones is what they're doing right now
|
|
Dracula
CS! Gold
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 26,105
Likes: 5,732
Location:
Member is Online
|
Post by Dracula on Mar 20, 2021 12:01:25 GMT -5
Oh, I'm not making that comparison, just thinking that's what Neverending is looking for. The LOTR comparison definitely closer to what we actually got (a mythic/epic approach to the Superhero). Just needs more pointy ears either way. This is the definitive cut no doubt but I am pretty disappointed we won't see more of this universe and the armada of darkseid, and that martian manhunter (at least for a while). Are we ruling out the possibility that WB might actually consider continuing off of this? It seems far too popular (95% from users on RT) for them to not consider it at all. Part of the problem is that Snyder's master plan was to have Justice League 2 be a big battle between the heroes and Darkseid's invasion and that Darkseid was going to turn Superman and shockingly win at the end, and then Justice League 3 would be what these Knightmare flashforwards are to and would have the ragtag group rally to finally win and set things right in the end... and if that sounds familiar to you it's because the MCU already kind of did it now. In fact I kind of suspect that Snyder got word of what they were going to be doing in Infinity War and Endgame and awkwardly put those Knightmare sequences in there just so he could "prove" that that was his idea all along and he wasn't just copying Marvel.
|
|
1godzillafan
Studio Head
Join Date: Feb 2017
I like pie!
Posts: 9,480
Likes: 6,217
Location:
Last Online Nov 8, 2024 5:42:00 GMT -5
|
Post by 1godzillafan on Mar 20, 2021 13:09:20 GMT -5
Are we ruling out the possibility that WB might actually consider continuing off of this? It seems far too popular (95% from users on RT) for them to not consider it at all. Never say never, after all there were points where we said there would "never" be interconnected superhero movies, "never" have Spidey in the MCU, and WB will "never" release the Snyder cut. All of those things happened. That being said, I wouldn't bet money on it. There are too many things working against it, starting with their initial conclusion that Snyder was costing too much money for work that is considered polarizing at best, and the writing on the wall was that they'd see little return in the long run. And the honest to god truth is that a big factor in the Snyder cut getting released at all was COVID and WB needed content for HBO Max and it was just handy. Couple that with all the headaches they've been dealing with from Ray Fisher (Snyder would also probably insist on casting Fisher in any JL sequel he makes, which is a HUGE can of worms to get into) and toxic #ReleaseTheSnyderCut behavior, I'm inclined to believe they just want to do this, put it out, and be done with it. There needs to be something game changing about the reception to this, not just positivity. There needs to be an indication that moving forward with more of this will lead to huge revenue. Only then will they put up with the headaches, because that's the bottom dollar.
|
|