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Post by Deleted on Jun 28, 2015 14:06:40 GMT -5
I'm curious as to what the criteria is for a president to be a 'good' president. Starting up a universal health care system, removing a huge symbol of oppression by legalizing gay marriages (as well as ending dont ask dont tell), establishing relations which country that has been an "enemy" for the last 50 years, regulating wall street succesfully, established clean energy regulations that are working, .... These seem like pretty strong accomplishments. A failed healthcare system full of flaws. DADT was enacted by the dems other savior Bill Clinton and the repeal would have been signed by any acting President. Opening up to Cuba is and will always be a mistake while they are under Castro rule. The SCOTUS ruled on Gay Marriage, not Obama. The regulation of Wall Street remains to be unseen and his clean energy regulations are a joke, costing tax payers millions, approaching billions in failed tax breaks for companies promising results and not following through on their promises by going bankrupt and moving jobs overseas. |
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Ramplate
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Post by Ramplate on Jun 28, 2015 14:07:19 GMT -5
To me Sanders is saying the right things at this time - I can't believe Clinton, even though she's said similar things because she's got money behind her, AND she had to step down from her Secretary of State position due to health concerns - what's she gonna do in the middle of high pressure POTUS duties? Bail? No thanks.
Sanders is very proactive (I live right next to the City he was Mayor of) and is on the case. His office got right back to my doctor's office with advice on a problem I was facing - the same day.
Two main reasons why Obama hasn't been as effective as most would have hoped is because (In my opinion) he bucked the good ole boy system and became president - he was also a largely unknown and junior senator from Illinois - like Carter, he came out of nowhere.
Sanders, as an independent, has worked with both sides on different issues and served on several committees for quite some time -he knows the field.
The rest of everyone else have pretty much piled into the clown car for the ride.
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Ramplate
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Post by Ramplate on Jun 28, 2015 14:11:00 GMT -5
Oh and Trump? lmao - he puts his foot in his mouth a lot! (Just recently too)
And do you want someone who has declared bankruptcy that many times to try and run the country? Hahaha
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Post by Deleted on Jun 28, 2015 14:12:31 GMT -5
I never said I wanted him to run, just a morbid curiosity because of his insanity. Same reason I would have voted for Perot.
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Post by Seakazoo on Jun 28, 2015 14:14:07 GMT -5
This is not the week to say Obama was a shit President. I actually agree with this. Normally I think that social issues are non-issues, but I absolutely believe that gay people should have every right to sign some paperwork and enjoy.... a tax writeoff? Inheriting someone else's debt and bad credit? Aside from inheriting your assets when you kick the bucket (which could easily be sorted with a will), I don't get the 'benefits' of being married, but if the gays want to do it who am I to say "boo"? I'm going to contradict my "social issues are non-issues" and say that I'm really disappointed in the republican candidates. I lean right, but I can't in good conscience vote for anyone who has actively tried to block abortion rights. And Trump is a whole different sort of awful. I have a hard time believing he's going to be the great job creator when of his companies have filed for chapter 11. It must be difficult to think of the needs of others with your head shoved so far up your own ass. |
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Post by Dracula on Jun 28, 2015 14:18:42 GMT -5
A failed healthcare system full of flaws. Lowest uninsured rate in history. DADT was enacted by the dems other savior Bill Clinton and the repeal would have been signed by any acting President. Clinton did that in a different time and for cynical reasons, no one's perfect. McCain openly and publicly opposed its repeal when it happened. Opening up to Cuba is and will always be a mistake while they are under Castro rule. Catro's an asshole, so are half of our closest allies, it was an out of date joke of a policy. The SCOTUS ruled on Gay Marriage, not Obama. Aside from the fact that two of the five justices who ruled on it would have be conservatives if Obama had lost, the simple fact is that the case never would have even gotten to the supreme court if Obama wasn't president. The left would have been too busy putting out whatever fires a Republican president would have started to build the gay rights movement that ultimately brought us to where we are. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 28, 2015 14:27:44 GMT -5
Lowest uninsured rate in history. Clinton did that in a different time and for cynical reasons, no one's perfect. McCain openly and publicly opposed its repeal when it happened. Catro's an asshole, so are half of our closest allies, it was an out of date joke of a policy. Aside from the fact that two of the five justices who ruled on it would have be conservatives if Obama had lost, the simple fact is that the case never would have even gotten to the supreme court if Obama wasn't president. The left would have been too busy putting out whatever fires a Republican president would have started to build the gay rights movement that ultimately brought us to where we are. Lowest uninsured rate that is now coming back and costing people thousands of dollars and getting denied treatment. So they still do not get treated and pay more for it. Good job Obama. McCain opposed it but it still would have been repealed. He opposed it for the same reason many did. The military is not a place that cares about sexuality, gay or straight. Keep it to yourself and do your job. Just because we have many asshole allies, doesnt mean we need one more. You can not argue hypothetical "fires". |
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Post by Dracula on Jun 28, 2015 14:34:55 GMT -5
Lowest uninsured rate in history. Clinton did that in a different time and for cynical reasons, no one's perfect. McCain openly and publicly opposed its repeal when it happened. Catro's an asshole, so are half of our closest allies, it was an out of date joke of a policy. Aside from the fact that two of the five justices who ruled on it would have be conservatives if Obama had lost, the simple fact is that the case never would have even gotten to the supreme court if Obama wasn't president. The left would have been too busy putting out whatever fires a Republican president would have started to build the gay rights movement that ultimately brought us to where we are. Lowest uninsured rate that is now coming back and costing people thousands of dollars and getting denied treatment. So they still do not get treated and pay more for it. Good job Obama. McCain opposed it but it still would have been repealed. He opposed it for the same reason many did. The military is not a place that cares about sexuality, gay or straight. Keep it to yourself and do your job. Just because we have many asshole allies, doesnt mean we need one more. You can not argue hypothetical "fires". Obamacare's been working fine for me. So McCain opposed DADT, but President McCain would have repealed it? And the embargo has been doing just a bang up job of ousting Castro's regime for the last sixty years. You cannot argue hypothetical "any presidents" who would have repealed DADT when the dude who literally would have been president actively supported it. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 28, 2015 14:42:10 GMT -5
Obamacare's been working fine for me. So McCain opposed DADT, but President McCain would have repealed it? And the embargo has been doing just a bang up job of ousting Castro's regime for the last sixty years. You cannot argue hypothetical "any presidents" who would have repealed DADT when the dude who literally would have been president actively supported it. You must be one of the lucky ones. Most who already had insurance are now paying more for it because of obamacare, those who did not have insurance but now have it found out the hard way that it screwed up their tax returns in most cases, costing them a large chunk of it. McCain did oppose but the pressure was there any any president would have appealed it, not really a hypothetical. As far as Cuba, the embargo did not have the effect it was originally intended to but it kept a communist regime in the dark, and broke. The regime was already doing that to its people and continues to do so, now the regime just has more money. |
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IanTheCool
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Post by IanTheCool on Jun 28, 2015 15:27:52 GMT -5
To be fair to Hilary, there is a difference between being born into a political dynasty and two largely self-made people coming together and building one from scratch. It wasn't a serious statement, I was just making a joke. |
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Post by Neverending on Jun 28, 2015 15:53:07 GMT -5
To be fair to Hilary, there is a difference between being born into a political dynasty and two largely self-made people coming together and building one from scratch. That will give Hillary Clinton the advantage if it ever comes down to her battling Jeb Bush. Coming from Massachusetts, I can say with absolute certainty that Elizabeth Warren would make a shit president. Explain yourself. I'm curious as to what the criteria is for a president to be a 'good' president. Starting up a universal health care system, removing a huge symbol of oppression by legalizing gay marriages (as well as ending dont ask dont tell), establishing relations which country that has been an "enemy" for the last 50 years, regulating wall street succesfully, established clean energy regulations that are working, .... These seem like pretty strong accomplishments. A failed healthcare system full of flaws. DADT was enacted by the dems other savior Bill Clinton and the repeal would have been signed by any acting President. Opening up to Cuba is and will always be a mistake while they are under Castro rule. The SCOTUS ruled on Gay Marriage, not Obama. The regulation of Wall Street remains to be unseen and his clean energy regulations are a joke, costing tax payers millions, approaching billions in failed tax breaks for companies promising results and not following through on their promises by going bankrupt and moving jobs overseas. Duke Leto a/k/a BrotherJustin, please stop watching Fox News. What is the alternative to ObamaCare? NOT having health care or having health care that can deny you service because of pre-existing health issues? ObamaCare isn't perfect - something that you can blame the Republicans for because ObamaCare is technically the Bob Dole health plan from the 1990's - but it's better than what we had before. And rebuilding a relationship with Cuba isn't a mistake. You know what's a mistake? Being friends with Saudi Arabia, the country that funded the 9/11 attacks. |
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Post by RedVader on Jun 28, 2015 15:59:24 GMT -5
I hate too say this but times was better under Clinton money and prices of gas food and so on. Can anyone say one great thing Obama has done. Outside of being first of his race too be president. Now i am not saying Hilary is a better option cause just because Bill is her husband does not mean she can fix things. Just saying its taken Bush and Obama too make a big mess and one is democrat the other a rep. Is it too late to get Fanible too run for president.
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Post by Neverending on Jun 28, 2015 16:05:10 GMT -5
Yes, things were better under Bill Clinton. No one is crazy enough to argue against that - except extremist ring wing people. George W. Bush was a disaster. And Obama has struggled because politics have gotten too partisan.
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IanTheCool
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Post by IanTheCool on Jun 28, 2015 16:06:32 GMT -5
I hate too say this but times was better under Clinton money and prices of gas food and so on. Can anyone say one great thing Obama has done. Outside of being first of his race too be president. Now i am not saying Hilary is a better option cause just because Bill is her husband does not mean she can fix things. Just saying its taken Bush and Obama too make a big mess and one is democrat the other a rep. Is it too late to get Fanible too run for president. We just said a bunch of things. And stop sucking up to fanible. |
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Post by RedVader on Jun 28, 2015 16:46:49 GMT -5
Yes, things were better under Bill Clinton. No one is crazy enough to argue against that - except extremist ring wing people. George W. Bush was a disaster. And Obama has struggled because politics have gotten too partisan. I have always felt we need a Independant President and Speaker Of The House too make it fair and just in dc |
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Post by RedVader on Jun 28, 2015 16:48:47 GMT -5
I have opinions too Ian on politics and believe me sucking up too Fanible is last things i want to do.
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Doomsday
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Post by Doomsday on Jun 28, 2015 18:37:22 GMT -5
Fanible has been known to ban anyone who disagrees with him politically.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 28, 2015 19:15:58 GMT -5
Yes, things were better under Bill Clinton. No one is crazy enough to argue against that - except extremist ring wing people. George W. Bush was a disaster. And Obama has struggled because politics have gotten too partisan. Obama blames everything bad in his tenure on Bush Jr. Things were better under Clinton because of the work of Bush Sr. then. This is the liberal way of thinking so it must be true. |
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Post by Dracula on Jun 28, 2015 19:31:48 GMT -5
Yes, things were better under Bill Clinton. No one is crazy enough to argue against that - except extremist ring wing people. George W. Bush was a disaster. And Obama has struggled because politics have gotten too partisan. Obama blames everything bad in his tenure on Bush Jr. Things were better under Clinton because of the work of Bush Sr. then. This is the liberal way of thinking so it must be true. Bush Sr. wasn't as bad as Bush Jr., there wasn't as deep a hole to dig out of. |
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Post by Neverending on Jun 28, 2015 21:01:32 GMT -5
Things were better under Clinton because of the work of Bush Sr. then. George H.W. Bush was a one-term President. He didn't have time to really leave an impact. He launched wars in Iraq and Panama and... that's it? There was "the war on drugs" which he inherited from the Reagan days. I remember in Elementary school they made us march around the neighborhood shouting, "SAY NO TO DRUGS!" What the fuck was the point of that? We were children. We barely knew what marijuana was. And... I guess he fucked up the economy cause that's the reason he lost to Bill Clinton. Other than that, I don't know what else to say about George H.W. Bush. Dana Carvey did a funny impression of him on SNL. Can we count that? |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 28, 2015 21:05:22 GMT -5
Nope, he must have been a great president because Clinton had it so easy during his turn. Bush Jr. had such a bad time because Clinton took two terms screwing things up. So by the time Bush Jr. got everything fixed, here comes Obama to screw it up again.
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Post by Neverending on Jun 28, 2015 21:14:31 GMT -5
Clinton took two terms screwing things up. Please enlighten us. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 28, 2015 21:40:31 GMT -5
Clinton took two terms screwing things up. Please enlighten us. So many things to bring up but let's start with the obvious ones. Lewinsky Chinagate Impeachment Bombing a pharmaceutical plant NAFTA Let Bin Laden get away Also, do some research and see how much he had to do with the 2008 financial crash because of things he did while in office. |
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Post by Doomsday on Jun 28, 2015 21:50:38 GMT -5
Well we could do presidential dick measuring contests until the end of time. Let's talk about something topical.
What do you guys think about the Confederate flag? Is everyone who flies one a racist? Should they be on government property? What about monuments for Confederate war veterans? What about Amazon removing Confederate flag listings but still choosing to sell things related to Lenin, Stalin and Che Guevara?
Discuss.
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Post by Neverending on Jun 28, 2015 21:53:18 GMT -5
Who cares? Wasn't Al Gore the one who got blamed for that? Regardless... it doesn't really matter now. We've spent this century borrowing money from China. They basically own us now. And you can blame your buddy Bush for that. How do you think we've been funding all these wars he started. LOL. No one said he was perfect. Most economist don't think NAFTA was a bad thing. It had its issues but it mostly worked out. I mean... there WAS a surplus when Clinton was in office. LMFAO. Are you really gonna go there? Your hero, Ronald Reagan, is the one who trained Bin Laden and left weapons for him to use. And your buddy Bush is the one who focused more on Iraq than Bin Laden after the 9/11 attacks. There's no doubt that Clinton made mistakes too, but Bush REALLY fucked things up. |
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