PG Cooper
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Post by PG Cooper on Jul 21, 2023 20:34:37 GMT -5
I saw a critic struggle to find the right words for Oppenheimer before settling on "awe-inspiring" and I think that sums it up best. The scope of apocalyptic fear, terror, and regret struggling to be contained in one person. It's overwhelming and riveting.
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SnoBorderZero
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Post by SnoBorderZero on Jul 21, 2023 21:05:16 GMT -5
Gathering my thoughts, but I thought Oppenheimer was terrific. Saw it in 70MM IMAX and it was glorious. Neverending tomorrow night I'll see Barbie.
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PhantomKnight
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Post by PhantomKnight on Jul 21, 2023 22:18:37 GMT -5
I'm gonna need time to digest Oppenheimer. That’s why you watch Barbie first. It’s the appetizer. Oppenheimer is the course. Nah, Oppenheimer gets priority, not Barbie.
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donny
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Post by donny on Jul 21, 2023 22:58:25 GMT -5
Gosling and Robbie needed more screen time together. Undeniable chemistry, but also under developed and not satisfying enough.
Also, in one persons opinion, Gerwig needed Saorise in this. Chalamet too. Made me sad.
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Post by Neverending on Jul 22, 2023 0:40:36 GMT -5
Gosling and Robbie needed more screen time together. Undeniable chemistry, but also under developed and not satisfying enough. Also, in one persons opinion, Gerwig needed Saorise in this. Chalamet too. Made me sad.
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donny
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Post by donny on Jul 22, 2023 10:37:50 GMT -5
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PG Cooper
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Post by PG Cooper on Jul 22, 2023 11:04:55 GMT -5
When it was announced in the mid-2010s that Christopher Nolan would be developing a WWII movie based on the Dunkirk evacuations, I remember thinking it sounded like a safer prestige picture and a chance to try his hand at something a bit more conventional. Little did I know Dunkirk would be such a consolidation of the director's major themes and stylistic choices, a pressure-cooker of high-tension whose non-linear narrative not only increased that tension exponentially, but also reinterpreted events to emphasize the causal relationships between its three perspectives rather than the little flow of time. Rather than tempering his own sensibilities to make a studio movie, Nolan enlisted the resources of the studio to enhance and expand his vision. And he has done it again with Oppenheimer.
Oppenheimer is a biopic specifically concerned with J. Robert Oppenheimer's development as a quantum physicist, culminating with the creation of the Atomic Bomb and the nuclear attacks on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. The plot is also contextualized by two frame narratives which themselves collide, Oppenheimer's hearing in 1954 regarding potential security risks due to past communist ties, and another hearing for Lewis Strauss, a former colleague and eventual enemy of Oppenheimer. It is a three-hour film largely consisting of conversations about science and politics and its the most pulse-pounding cinematic experience of the summer. Nolan's sense of spectacle is not absent amidst presumably dry material, it hypercharges it, scientific discovery and political deceit presented through Oppenheimer's visions of apocalyptic terror and the chasm of guilt regret that causes physical space to distort. To that end, this is most certainly the closest Nolan's visuals have ever come to surreal. Ghostly visions appear occasionally in the likes of Insomnia and The Dark Knight Rises, but Oppenheimer goes much further, as timelines blur and visions become indistinguishable from reality.
For all the propulsive power that drives Oppenheimer - both the man and the film as a whole - the non-linear structure adds a haunting quality to the proceedings. Oppenheimer's development and progress on the Manhattan project are always counter-pointed by the frame story, as Oppenheimer is grilled by hawkish generals and politicians who loved the bomb but aren't crazy about the unionization talk or efforts to reduce H-bomb production. In these scenes we see glimpses of a far different Robert Oppenheimer, one haunted by sorrow and guilt. These feelings are at first merely implied by Cillian Murphy's hollowed face and sunken eyes, but they become much more pronounced as both Oppenheimer's hearing and the Manhattan project concurrently move closer to their climaxes. The result is a structure which rather brilliantly quells Oppenheimer's triumphs. All the excitement from scientific discovery or putting a team together and problem solving is levied by the weight of the grim future. A common logline to justify the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki is that they were necessary to end the war, that the end justified the means. Nolan's structure dismantles that notion, not merely because of the inhumane violence inherent to the nuclear attacks against Japan, but in demonstrating how "the end" goes well past World War II.
So much of the film's devastating power is owed to Nolan's key collaborators - the colliding of images of Jennifer Lame's editing, Ludwig Göransson's at once delicate and momentous score, the magnitude of Hoyte van Hoytema's imagery, Nathan Crowley's at once authentic and atmospheric production design - the whole is just a masterclass of large-budget Hollywood filmmaking, and how special that can be when applied to something other than escapist entertainments. And while certainly a far cry from a traditional biopic, Oppenheimer absolutely delivers in amazing performances. It's amazing after to many supporting roles and cameos in The Dark Knight Trilogy Cillian Murphy finally has a full showcase with Nolan and he completely knocks it out of the park. His Oppenheimer is multi-faceted and distinct long before he's leading physicists in Los Alamos, brilliant and pompous, alienating but bewilderingly charismatic too. As a greater weight sets within his soul, Murphy's subtle physical transformation is astounding. The supporting cast is also littered with stellar work. Robert Downey Jr. will likely be a shoe-in for Best Supporting Actor and Emily Blunt is cuttingly powerful with far less screen time, but I want to especially highlight Jason Clarke, who has a largely thankless role as Oppenheimer's prosecutor that he absolutely kills. Then there's Florence Pugh, who's tragic Jean Tatlock preludes the guilt to come. The one performance that gave me some pause is Gary Oldman as President Truman. There's a hammy quality to Oldman's work that at first struck me as odd, but has grown on me tremendously. After Oppenheimer has delivered the bomb to the United States who have utilized its destructive capabilities, who appropriate the man comes face to face with such an obscene portrait of evil.
This is a film that deserves consideration as possibly Christopher Nolan's best, let alone one of the best film's of the year.
A+
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PG Cooper
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Post by PG Cooper on Jul 22, 2023 11:33:35 GMT -5
I'm also glad I held off on watching the Dune Part Two trailer until I was in a theater.
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Post by IanTheCool on Jul 22, 2023 12:56:48 GMT -5
I'm also glad I held off on watching the Dune Part Two trailer until I was in a theater. I kinda wish I didn't see it even then
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PG Cooper
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Post by PG Cooper on Jul 22, 2023 17:00:42 GMT -5
I'm so fucking excited to see Oppenheimer tonight. There’s one scene in Barbie that I’m dying for you to watch, but I’m sure it got spoiled by now. 1godzillafan knows what I’m referring to. Let’s just say there’s an offer you can’t refuse. That was fun, but in terms of bits that felt like they were calling me out specifically I probably preferred Ken's belt buckle. As for the rest of Barbie... eh, probably the year's biggest disappointment. It had its moments - the two dance numbers (especially the second), Ryan Gosling, the final line - but it's so caked in self-satisfying irony that I found it irritating. I wouldn't mind the most trite and basic feminist observations (it's a movie based off a toy afterall) if the movie wasn't so prone to speechifying or if it was funnier, but it really wasn't. Couple of chuckles, mostly from Gosling, but I certainly wasn't in stitches. The visual creativity is appreciated but it wasn't enough, either to make up for the lack of laughs, or to overcome being a movie based on a toy.
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PG Cooper
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Post by PG Cooper on Jul 22, 2023 18:17:47 GMT -5
Not since Citizen Kane's poster declared "It's Terrific!" has a tagline so aptly summarized the film it's advertising. "If you love Barbie this movie is for you." Of course it is, from the glittery surface of pinks and pastels to the references and nods to the real toyline's history to the film's conviction that Barbie isn't just a toy, but taps into and reflects a deeper aspect of womanhood. "If you hate Barbie this movie is for you." And of course it is, the movie eager to point out how Barbie makes women feel bad by promoting unrealistic beauty standards or promoting crass consumerism implicitly and explicitly or supposedly existing to make girls happy while enriching a boardroom full of cis men. That flavour of self-effacing corporate irony underlines the entirety of Greta Gerwig's summer blockbuster, allowing Barbie to luxuriate in Mattel products so long as it also throws out some stale jabs at the company's mistakes. This self protective irony rarely lets up. Think the film's version of feminism leans on white saviour tropes or that Margot Robbie is too much of a bombshell to adequately make a point about harmful beauty standards? So does the movie, and it's happy to let you know!
That the actual feminist commentary of the film is largely basic and cliché need not itself be an issue. It's a Barbie movie after all, no one should be expecting Chantal Ackerman, but the third act finds itself bogged down in endless speechifying. Here, the fun grinds to a halt so the movie can pontificate on what it means to be a woman under patriarchy. The insight's here are modest at best, but the bigger issue is this misguided need to an important issue movie when it just inherently is not equipped for that. And even when Barbie is allowing itself to just be fun I don't think it's fun enough. The movie has a couple of good jokes and comedic elements - Ryan Gosling's delight in learning of patriarchy, the final line - but I can't say I find the movie especially funny. A couple of chuckles here and there, but also some groaners, even before the movie stops with the jokes to get real. Also, why, in the year of our lord 2023, is Will Ferrell still getting major roles in mainstream studio comedies? Are we not past this?
To be sure, the film has its moments. Barbieland creatively renders doll aesthetics in live-action, the soundtrack wonderfully counterpoints the action, the costumes are great, Robbie and Gosling both give really committed performances, and there are two musical numbers which are definite highlights. That second number in particular rules. But these positives are outweighed by the ponderous need to be more than just a studio comedy, or the self-protective layers of irony that suffocate the substance. This is one of the year's biggest disappointments.
C-
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Post by Neverending on Jul 22, 2023 18:26:52 GMT -5
Robert Downey Jr. will likely be a shoe-in for Best Supporting Actor and Emily Blunt is cuttingly powerful with far less screen time, but I want to especially highlight Jason Clarke, who has a largely thankless role as Oppenheimer's prosecutor that he absolutely kills. Then there's Florence Pugh, who's tragic Jean Tatlock preludes the guilt to come. The one performance that gave me some pause is Gary Oldman as President Truman. There's a hammy quality to Oldman's work that at first struck me as odd, but has grown on me tremendously. After Oppenheimer has delivered the bomb to the United States who have utilized its destructive capabilities, who appropriate the man comes face to face with such an obscene portrait of evil. Don’t forget Bernard the Elf from the Santa Clause. A grandfatherly Jew always offering Oppenheimer something to eat. Or one of the Safdie Bros that either got fat for the role or is under prosthetics. I couldn’t tell. Or Han Solo having a battle of wits with Tony Stark. Or Josh Hartnett who most definitely got fat for the role. Or Olivia Thirlby in the role of Random Feminist.
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Post by Neverending on Jul 22, 2023 18:28:09 GMT -5
As for the rest of Barbie... eh, probably the year's biggest disappointment. It had its moments - the two dance numbers (especially the second), Ryan Gosling, the final line - but it's so caked in self-satisfying irony that I found it irritating. I wouldn't mind the most trite and basic feminist observations (it's a movie based off a toy afterall) if the movie wasn't so prone to speechifying or if it was funnier, but it really wasn't. Couple of chuckles, mostly from Gosling, but I certainly wasn't in stitches. The visual creativity is appreciated but it wasn't enough, either to make up for the lack of laughs, or to overcome being a movie based on a toy.
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PhantomKnight
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Post by PhantomKnight on Jul 22, 2023 19:16:00 GMT -5
Oppenheimer Initial Thoughts
I'm not in any state of mind right now to fully articulate my thoughts, but wow. It's a staggering achievement, the best of the year so far, and definitely in the conversation for one of Nolan's best films, period. I'm just kind of in awe about it right now. It never felt like three hours and had me riveted the whole time -- a movie that's just people in rooms talking, the majority of the time. It totally makes you feel the weight of everything. Also, the sound design and the music are fantastic.
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Neverending
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Post by Neverending on Jul 22, 2023 20:05:52 GMT -5
definitely in the conversation for one of Nolan's best films Let’s not exaggerate.
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PhantomKnight
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Post by PhantomKnight on Jul 22, 2023 20:09:05 GMT -5
definitely in the conversation for one of Nolan's best films Let’s not exaggerate. We're not.
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Post by Neverending on Jul 22, 2023 20:21:34 GMT -5
Better Than OppenheimerMemento Batman Begins The Prestige The Dark Knight Inception Worse Than OppenheimerFollowing Insomnia The Dark Knight Rises Interstellar Dunkirk Tenet Oppenheimer is in the middle. It’s mid-tier Nolan.
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PG Cooper
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Post by PG Cooper on Jul 22, 2023 20:23:11 GMT -5
Time will well, but it's certainly a movie that invites such consideration.
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PhantomKnight
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Post by PhantomKnight on Jul 22, 2023 20:28:44 GMT -5
Better Than OppenheimerMemento Batman Begins The Prestige The Dark Knight Inception Worse Than OppenheimerFollowing Insomnia The Dark Knight Rises Interstellar Dunkirk Tenet Oppenheimer is in the middle. It’s mid-tier Nolan.
Note that I also said in the conversation. I'm not jumping to conclusions yet. HOWEVER, I will say that, stylistically, Oppenheimer sees Nolan at some of his most ambitious, which is also tied in to just how effective the storytelling is here. And that, I feel, is going to go a long way for this movie.
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Post by Neverending on Jul 22, 2023 20:30:04 GMT -5
Time will well, but it's certainly a movie that invites such consideration. We’ll see if Oppenheimer turns out to be the first Nolan movie that Doomsday likes. That’ll be the true test.
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Post by Doomsday on Jul 22, 2023 23:06:51 GMT -5
Time will well, but it's certainly a movie that invites such consideration. We’ll see if Oppenheimer turns out to be the first Nolan movie that Doomsday likes. That’ll be the true test. Tenet
So here we are, me and Chris together again for the first time since Dunkirk. Where to even begin? I know my reputation here over the years has been that of someone who despises Chris Nolan and while I've done my part to contribute to that inflated image it's really not true. Do I have issues with some of his creative quirks? Sure and I've launched into those before, but in no sense do I consider him to be a bad filmmaker. Tenet was the first Nolan movie I missed out on in theaters since The Prestige but that was because of the pandemic along with having a very pregnant wife and 2 year old kid, not because I had any aversion to the movie itself. The covid/wife combo didn't exactly lend itself to letting a guy duck out for three hours to do much of anything let alone seeing a sci-fi action movie and by the time I got back into my regular movie-viewing groove there was more than enough I had to catch up on. I guess the main reason I hadn't gotten around to seeing Tenet until now is because I heard some pretty tepid opinions on it so I wasn't exactly rushing to give it a spin. Maybe it's because I approached it with that mindset that I ended up really enjoying the movie even though there are still some logical gaps that I'm not quite sure the movie is able to thoroughly jump. I won't go into the synopsis as I'm sure most everyone on these boards has seen the movie by now. My overall opinion is kind of all over the place, much like this movie. When it comes to all the ins and outs of the method of time travel the movie presents, I think I got it. I'm sure it would make more sense on a rewatch but who knows when exactly I'll be able to watch it again. The technical logic that Robert Pattinson presents comes at you hard and fast and you aren't really given much of a chance to digest it or comprehend whether what they're doing makes sense or has any purpose however you're quickly launched into the next act of the movie which all contain their own heist or seige sequence. It's sometimes easy to predict where the movie is going to take you but the reveals do make sense and work rather smoothly. The action sequences are also done well and it helps that the beats feel structured. It very much carries Inception vibes in that there are effective and well done sequences contained within an overarching, mind-bending narrative. I read that Nolan spent years working on this movie and I assume that there's some sort of stable logic between being inverted and not and all the things it entails (seeing your reflection, air being unbreathable, temperatures being flipped) and while the film seems to gloss over some of the explanation, sometimes at its own expense, it doesn't necessarily hurt the story that's going on in front of you. I'd say the one thing that stuck out at me was Kenneth Branagh's motivation being so thin that it's almost nonsensical to the point of being a 70s Bond villain, almost as if he's destroying the world for the sake of destroying the world, but it didn't stop the movie dead in its tracks. I'm curious as to how it would hold up on a rewatch, whether I would like it more or if it would come off as more plain and losing luster like Inception did, but for a first watch I had a very fun time. A- so says Doomsday
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Neverending
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Post by Neverending on Jul 23, 2023 1:33:16 GMT -5
That was the Covid side effects talking. Tenet is a D+ at best.
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Post by Neverending on Jul 23, 2023 2:14:39 GMT -5
You weren’t kidding.
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PG Cooper
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Post by PG Cooper on Jul 23, 2023 8:18:51 GMT -5
You weren’t kidding. Literally me.
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donny
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Post by donny on Jul 23, 2023 9:31:53 GMT -5
I watched Jurassic Park last night and noticed this.
Shared universe.
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