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Post by Deleted on Sept 9, 2015 15:46:28 GMT -5
Most don't want to assimilate. That is why so many of immigrants, legal and illegal, still don't speak English after being here for a decade or longer.
Watch what the immigrants do to Italy, Germany, and the other euro countries they are flooding in to now due to the war in Syria. In 10 years they will have taken over neighborhoods and made it a filthy place, just like the crap hole they left behind.
Some immigrants come and assimilate and make better lives. Most don't and just ruin towns.
Plenty of small towns in my area now that have whole blocks that look like Juarez due to illegals coming in for farm work. This isn't some made up bigotry, this is cold hard fact.
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Doomsday
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Post by Doomsday on Sept 9, 2015 17:16:27 GMT -5
Unfortunately my experience is very much the same. Several areas in Los Angeles are essentially Mexico. You get out of the car, there are little Spanish-speaking shops, signs are in Spanish, billboards are in Spanish, even commercials are in Spanish. Bleeding hearts will tell you 'it's the growing diversity in America, it's actually a good thing, don't be racist!' However what they fail (or in most cases refuse) to recognize is that if you don't speak conversational English you're basically relegating yourself to the lower class. You'll be washing windows or cutting lawns. The reason it bothers me isn't because many people can't speak English, I won't expect that from a 40-something man who emigrated here, however there are second and even third generation Hispanic people who don't speak English, they aren't learning English at home and they aren't getting the one essential tool for success that they need. Of course, the bleeding hearts will attribute that to racism as always but it still doesn't help these people assimilate which is something they need to do, not for my sake but for theirs.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 9, 2015 17:39:27 GMT -5
Agreed.
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Ramplate
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Post by Ramplate on Sept 10, 2015 7:12:18 GMT -5
It's been said that the USA is a melting pot. It has never been a melting pot, and couldn't/shouldn't be so.
It has always been more of a salad bowl.
Of course people who haven't grown up here are going to be different in some ways, but they will assimilate in other ways.
Immigrants have always formed neighborhoods with people who come from the same regions they do - that's just natural, and a way to cope with a new environment. Not all will learn English - learning a new language is hard unless you are very young to start with.
I would think that most do understand some English, and a lot more are bilingual - especially the younger ones.
First generation immigrants will always have and create some friction or problems. I'm sure they would look at you the same way if you moved to their countries at first. It doesn't help to make them feel isolated or hated - extending help and support works much better.
We have good neighbors here from Asia - yes they speak their own language most of the time - doesn't make them bad neighbors
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Seakazoo
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Post by Seakazoo on Sept 10, 2015 8:30:59 GMT -5
Unfortunately my experience is very much the same. Several areas in Los Angeles are essentially Mexico. You get out of the car, there are little Spanish-speaking shops, signs are in Spanish, billboards are in Spanish, even commercials are in Spanish. Bleeding hearts will tell you 'it's the growing diversity in America, it's actually a good thing, don't be racist!' However what they fail (or in most cases refuse) to recognize is that if you don't speak conversational English you're basically relegating yourself to the lower class. You'll be washing windows or cutting lawns. The reason it bothers me isn't because many people can't speak English, I won't expect that from a 40-something man who emigrated here, however there are second and even third generation Hispanic people who don't speak English, they aren't learning English at home and they aren't getting the one essential tool for success that they need. Of course, the bleeding hearts will attribute that to racism as always but it still doesn't help these people assimilate which is something they need to do, not for my sake but for theirs. Usually with these types of jobs pay cash. Cash payments means no income taxes are being paid. I sincerely doubt someone who doesn't bother to learn the language of the country they are living in is up to date on their tax law knowledge and they probably aren't doing their taxes or declaring any income. This is what irks me the most because the same bleeding hearts who think this behavior is acceptable are the same people who insist that the wealthy aren't paying enough taxes. I understand wanting to preserve your heritage and speaking your native language in the home, or with family and friends, but you are correct when you say that learning and speaking English is an essential tool for success. Not learning the language will not get you far in this country, and I thought that the whole point of coming here was to make a better life for yourself. |
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Post by Ramplate on Sept 10, 2015 9:45:08 GMT -5
However,.... It is pretty difficult to concentrate on learning a new language when one is also trying to make ends meet, irk out a living, raising a family, and keeping food in their mouths and a roof over their heads.
Learning the new language often takes a back seat. However, a great deal of immigrant children are very bright, and good students, they are the ones who are working hard to give their families a better life here.
Sometimes it takes more than the first generation for things to happen, and with a lot of American families - they also find that the next generation are even more behind their parents due to how the economy and opportunities are.
I know people who grew up in nice houses here who are now homeless - is it their fault? sometimes, other times it's just the way things are in this country
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SnoBorderZero
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Post by SnoBorderZero on Sept 10, 2015 10:07:47 GMT -5
Yeah, I'm all for people coming here and making a better life for themselves and for their families. Unless you're a full-blooded Native American, you have to maintain some sentiment for immigrants since, well, your lineage can be traced to it as well. But I do think it's getting out of hand and there needs to be some reform. For example, people flee from countries like Mexico and Venezuela and end up here... and it's on OUR dime to harbor them and send them back. These other countries are dumping their problems onto us and aren't giving us the necessary financial support (because let's face it, they got nothing to give) or regulating this problem within their own countries before it even becomes our problem. I don't buy the idea that there's more bad apples than good coming here and that they're running the community into the ground, like Ramplate said it's not easy to assimilate to a new country especially when you have little to no money to do so. Doomsday outlined a good plan that I think would not only benefit Americans upset with the current immigration laws and stances (and I can't disagree there, it's gotten out of hand, we can't be relied upon to save the world and take care of other countries' dirty laundry) but also give immigrants a chance to properly assimilate and get themselves jobs where they can't be taken advantage of by shady employers. It's all a bit of a pipedream and there's no easy way to get it done, but something needs to change. Not Donald Trump change, but you get the idea.
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Doomsday
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Post by Doomsday on Sept 10, 2015 10:13:49 GMT -5
Like I said in my second post, I don't fault every person who doesn't know English. There are millions of people who emigrated here, legally or otherwise, who didn't know any English. I don't expect them to immediately pick it up and have a flawless conversation with me. I understand they're looking for better lives and are doing what they can with what they have. However it's a different story with second and third generation Hispanics. For whatever reason there are millions of children born in the US who aren't being taught English, the one skill that will be most helpful with improving their economic situation. What's worse is that many people don't even find it necessary and to suggest it is promote 'nativism' and racism. Sure there are other factors that affect these families for better or for worse but the key thing people can do when they arrive in this country is to learn English AND ensure that their children do the same. Not broken English, not a little bit of English, English. Or we can settle for having these poor, rundown Mexico offshoots that you see all over Los Angeles that nobody gives a shit about. To do THAT is wrong.
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Ramplate
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Post by Ramplate on Sept 10, 2015 10:29:41 GMT -5
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Post by SnoBorderZero on Sept 10, 2015 10:55:12 GMT -5
Yeah, that's a good point Doomsday. I feel like sometimes people are afraid to talk about immigration because they'll be labeled racist or not sympathetic to their plight, and instead resort to blatantly ignoring the problem altogether which is much worse anyways. People drive by those parts of LA all the time (I know exactly what you're talking about, the state of those neighborhoods is deplorable) and just shrug their shoulders and say well that's just how it is. But it doesn't have to be like that. Just because people got over here doesn't mean they have the necessary tools to succeed and survive. Regulation and reform would help both sides of the immigration battle, and I feel like a lot of that starts with getting these other countries to pitch in and stop dumping their issues on us. It's not fair that the world gets to criticize us as being militaristic bullies and the police of the world but when their country starts to see problems they rely on us as their sympathetic crutch. Can we expect the Mexican, Venezuelan, and Honduran governments to step up on this matter, though? Eh, I'm not holding out any hope on that, those countries are in the state they're in for a reason.
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Ramplate
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Post by Ramplate on Sept 11, 2015 15:13:53 GMT -5
"I've been just drilled by TV hosts over the past week, 'How dare you say that, uh, it's not the law of the land?'" Huckabee said. "Because that's their phrase, 'it's the law of the land.' Michael, the Dred Scott decision of 1857 still remains to this day the law of the land which says that black people aren't fully human. Does anybody still follow the Dred Scott Supreme Court decision?"  |
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Doomsday
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Post by Doomsday on Sept 11, 2015 16:20:55 GMT -5
Poor Huckabee. At what point do you say 'you know, this President thing just wasn't meant to be.'
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SnoBorderZero
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Post by SnoBorderZero on Sept 11, 2015 16:56:51 GMT -5
You would've thought he figured that out last time in 2012, but now he's resorting to desperate attempts and statements for people to actually remember who he is. To his credit he's gone from the guy everyone forgets is running to the guy who says and does really stupid things. "Hey, it's that one guy who compared Kim Davis to Rosa Parks. What a moron!"
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Ramplate
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Post by Ramplate on Sept 17, 2015 22:10:44 GMT -5
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SnoBorderZero
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Post by SnoBorderZero on Sept 18, 2015 9:48:23 GMT -5
Yeah, I didn't think it was possible but CNN may have put on an even more disjointed and farce of a debate than Fox News did.
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Ramplate
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Post by Ramplate on Sept 21, 2015 7:50:33 GMT -5
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Ramplate
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Post by Ramplate on Sept 21, 2015 14:24:08 GMT -5
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Post by SnoBorderZero on Sept 21, 2015 14:40:13 GMT -5
These are great, keep 'em coming.
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Ramplate
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Post by Ramplate on Sept 21, 2015 15:49:30 GMT -5
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Ramplate
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Post by Ramplate on Sept 21, 2015 15:57:57 GMT -5
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Post by SnoBorderZero on Sept 21, 2015 16:14:48 GMT -5
Kinda surprising but not really. He had a lot of hype going in but then faded fast. One idiot down, plenty more to go. |
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Post by Jibbs on Sept 21, 2015 19:16:47 GMT -5
Nice! Suck it, Walker.
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Ramplate
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Post by Ramplate on Sept 23, 2015 14:00:06 GMT -5
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Post by Doomsday on Sept 23, 2015 15:35:57 GMT -5
Clinton is done. Even if she wins the nomination she won't become President. Way too many people don't like her and at best they'll only vote for her because they don't want to vote for the Republican. People are energized for Bernie Sanders. Heck, people are energized for Trump and Ben Carson. The only people who are energized for Clinton are those who are only voting for her because she's a woman. Everyone else understands she's just more of the same.
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Post by Dracula on Sept 23, 2015 17:52:58 GMT -5
I wouldn't take that terribly seriously, the guy who wrote the book that story is reported in is really shady and the last book he wrote about Clinton was filled with proven errors. |
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