Neverending
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Post by Neverending on May 4, 2019 15:52:56 GMT -5
I watched Batman (1989) on the big screen. I’ll preface this by saying that Avengers: Endgame is still dominating real estate at theatres so I had to watch it in a small auditorium. Whether that affected the presentation or not, can’t say for sure. I’m also gonna assume it was the 4K that’s coming out in June. PICTURE QUALITYOne of the charms of Batman (1989) is the British film and cameras that were used. The movie looks foreign which adds to its aesthetic 40’s noir mixed with 80’s hip. Watching it on the big screen in presumably 4K it looks off. There’s a lot of motion blur when the camera and the objects are moving, as if the lens is struggling to focus. Two examples are the scene in which Knox is walking through the newsroom as he gets mocked by his colleagues and the scene at Wayne’s charity ball. Curiously, none of the action scenes suffer from this problem. Did they use different equipments for those and/or a better crew led by Derek Meddings (of James Bond fame) and Peter MacDonald (of Rambo fame)? There’s also a noticeable change in film quality (from less British to more American) in the climax in which Batman fights The Joker at top of the cathedral. In the past, people have complained about that scene being too dark. Here it’s brightly lit, but it isn’t artificial. It’s natural looking as if that’s how the scene was always supposed to look. If y’all recall, the scene features Commissioner Gordon ordering his men to turn spotlights on outside the cathedral and that’s the source of lighting for the scene. Although the logistics of those spotlights, from the ground level, perfectly shining on top of the cathedral is pure nonsense. A pleasant surprise of watching the movie on the big screen is noticing little things that you may have missed in home viewings. Knox has a picture of Popeye on the board behind his desk. Eckard awkwardly nroaming around in the background when Bob puts a gun to Gordon’s head. Remember the scene where Joker is cutting photos? It starts with a shot of a desk stacked with pictures of a guy with a creepy grin. On that desk there’s a folder that says “chemical tests” or something like that. Basically it’s photos of Joker experimenting with his Smile-x gas. When the mimes show up at City Hall there’s a overhead wide shot that let's you see everything they’re doing. Right after, when Joker kills the monster, you clearly see the cops not reacting. Nice touches like those allow you to re-appreciate the movie. This isn’t Christopher Nolan over-explaining everything. The visuals can tell the story. SOUND MIXIf this is what the 4K blu-ray is gonna sound like, hold on to your VHS copies. They tried to “modernize” the mix at the expense of Danny Elfman’s score. The music switches back & forth between the center speakers & side speakers depending on the need of the sound effects. Some scenes the music is the focus while the sound effects step aside. Other scenes the music is drowned out by the sound effects. The scene where the Batmobile breaks into Axis Chemicals, the mixer went all out of the gunfire and explosions. There’s also strange additions and subtractions. When Bruce Wayne suits up, they add swooshing sounds. When the Batwing crashes they add noises of it shutting down. Remember when the mimes shoot up City Hall? Remember that very distinctive sound of the bullet hiding Bruce Wayne’s jacket? They removed it. Bastards! On the plus side, they did turn up the volume on Joker’s boombox that he takes to the art museum and Vicki’s apartment. You can clearly hear the music that’s playing. Speaking of which, in the art museum scene, they may have digitally enhanced Joker’s gas that kills everyone. It’s very purple and very in-your-face. Also, all the smoke and fog throughout the movie really pop out as well. OVERALL,While the presentation wasn’t ideal (and puts into question whether the 4K blu-ray is worth getting), it was still fun to watch all of our favorite scenes on the big screen. Some of the Joker scenes suffer from the motion blur, but fortunately, all the big Batman scenes avoid that issue. The rooftop fight. The Axis Chemicals scene. The art museum/street chase/alley fight. Driving Vicki Vale to the Batcave. The batcave scene. The batwing scene. The cathedral. The ending. There’s sound mix issues with some of those, but that could just be a nitpick on my part. The cathedral sequence, all of it, is the highlight of this whole presentation. No big issues with the picture and sound. If y’all wanna show Nolan fans why you prefer Tim Burton, this the part to show.
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Post by Neverending on May 6, 2019 21:10:18 GMT -5
BATMAN RETURNS (1992)No complaints whatsoever about the theatrical experience. Picture & sound were almost great. 9.5/10. So let’s instead cover the movie itself, especially since we can’t rely on PG Cooper to do a video essay. Of all the Batman movies, this has one arguably aged the best. That don’t mean it’s the best one. Batman (1989) and The Dark Knight are still the good standard. But as Doomsday will no doubt point out, you can nitpick them to death. They’re movies of their time and their creators. Returns, on the other hand, is more relevant than ever. You have a powerfully feminist portrayal of Catwoman. There’s themes of mental health and emotional & physical abuse. There’s sprinkles of commentary for politics and income inequality. If released today, people would hail it as a cultural beacon. If generic movies like Wonder Woman and Black Panther can receive acclaim, why not this? Amusingly though, all this is wrapped in one of the most entertainingly stupid plots. It’s all centered around the character of Max Shreck (played quite well by Christopher Walken) a business guy that wants to build a power plant (that’s actually gonna steal energy) and when he is opposed by the mayor, he launches a recall campaign and tries to replace the mayor with the Penguin. Um..... what? The Penguin’s schemes also don’t make much sense. Yeah, he wants to kidnap children and strap missiles on actual penguins so they can blow up the city, but does Gotham not have a friggin’ police force? Are the national guards not around? Does Batman have to protect the city on his own? Is he the Sheriff from High Noon? None of that really matters though because one has to question if this movie even takes place in reality. It almost comes across as a therapeutic nightmare in which logic doesn’t apply. Batman Returns is an emotional journey and not necessarily a cerebral one. It’s what separates it from, say, Ang Lee’s Hulk. You can’t be goofy but also intellectual cause people will poke holes in your story. But you can be silly and heartfelt and the nonsense becomes part of the charm. I guess that’s how... metaphors work.
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Doomsday
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Post by Doomsday on May 7, 2019 20:12:34 GMT -5
I was actually planning on seeing Batman until I found out the woman preordered me the blu ray for my birthday. I think that was her way of getting out of seeing the movie but hey fine by me, I've already seen it in 35mm 3 or 4 times.
But Batman Returns, over time and dozens of viewings I think I've come to appreciate it more than I enjoy it. It's a cool movie with a lot of horrific stuff mixed in with a lot of cheese but damn is it a ballsy movies. Nobody, nobody would attempt to make a superhero film that's anywhere close to Batman Returns in terms of just going for it (granted no studio would give anyone enough leash to do it) and while it has its share of detractors it has definitely withstood the test of time in that we still talk about it. And Michelle Pfeiffer is fantastic. Now I want to go back and watch it again.
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Post by Pbar on May 8, 2019 10:08:52 GMT -5
'89 is a perfect Batman movie until Vicki Vale wakes up in bed from being in the Batcave. Also, Nicholson absolutely sucks as The Joker, and kind of ruins the movie.
Returns, which for a long time I liked better than '89, is Exhibit A on why Tim Burton is a glorified production designer when he doesn't care. Sure, Pfieffer does a solid job, and I'd agree it's the best Batman suit, but there's a disconnect here.
I don't think either has aged well, outside of aesthetics.
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Neverending
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Post by Neverending on May 10, 2019 18:20:41 GMT -5
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Frizzo the Clown
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Post by Frizzo the Clown on May 10, 2019 19:28:00 GMT -5
Oh, man, I remember the summer I saw this movie. I was ten, and this movie, more than any other I'd seen at that point, resonated with me. I had several t-shirts, and I even had a door length Batman poster hanging on my wall. Batman was everywhere, and it was fantastic. Wal-Mart even had someone cosplaying as Batman in-store signing autographs. I knew it wasn't actually Batman (I'm not an idiot, contrary to popular belief, but you're damn right I got an autograph. Even though once I really started reading comics, I was a Marvel guy, I grew up with reruns of the Adam West tv show, and these movies. Man, '89 was a great summer for movies. I still love this movie.
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Post by Neverending on May 11, 2019 1:26:21 GMT -5
Oh, man, I remember the summer I saw this movie. I was ten, and this movie, more than any other I'd seen at that point, resonated with me. I had several t-shirts, and I even had a door length Batman poster hanging on my wall. Batman was everywhere, and it was fantastic. Wal-Mart even had someone cosplaying as Batman in-store signing autographs. I knew it wasn't actually Batman (I'm not an idiot, contrary to popular belief, but you're damn right I got an autograph. Even though once I really started reading comics, I was a Marvel guy, I grew up with reruns of the Adam West tv show, and these movies. Man, '89 was a great summer for movies. I still love this movie. Thank you for sharing you memories, Frizzo. Have your kids reached the age they can enjoy the MCU?
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Frizzo the Clown
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Post by Frizzo the Clown on May 11, 2019 16:22:27 GMT -5
Oh, man, I remember the summer I saw this movie. I was ten, and this movie, more than any other I'd seen at that point, resonated with me. I had several t-shirts, and I even had a door length Batman poster hanging on my wall. Batman was everywhere, and it was fantastic. Wal-Mart even had someone cosplaying as Batman in-store signing autographs. I knew it wasn't actually Batman (I'm not an idiot, contrary to popular belief, but you're damn right I got an autograph. Even though once I really started reading comics, I was a Marvel guy, I grew up with reruns of the Adam West tv show, and these movies. Man, '89 was a great summer for movies. I still love this movie. Thank you for sharing you memories, Frizzo. Have your kids reached the age they can enjoy the MCU? The youngest is a massive Spider-Man fan. Picked him all on her own. Loves Homecoming, she loved Spider-Verse, she's got t-shirts, toys (well...my old toys anyway). She's said time and time again that he's her favorite. Though, she is also quite familiar with Cap, Thor, Iron Man, Hulk and Starlord. She recognizes all of them by sight.
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Post by Neverending on May 1, 2021 0:58:08 GMT -5
SOUND MIXIf this is what the 4K blu-ray is gonna sound like, hold on to your VHS copies. They tried to “modernize” the mix at the expense of Danny Elfman’s score. The music switches back & forth between the center speakers & side speakers depending on the need of the sound effects. Some scenes the music is the focus while the sound effects step aside. Other scenes the music is drowned out by the sound effects. Doomsdaywww.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/danny-elfman-batman-score-tim-burton-movie
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Post by Doomsday on Apr 30, 2022 17:47:03 GMT -5
So I was watching the blu ray today because I wanted to show my kid a scene of the Batmobile and naturally I started watching more of it. I don't know much about the history of this 4k/blu-ray combo that came out a couple years back but man does the whole thing look super brightened up. It really brings out the darker backgrounds that you might have overlooked while watching it over the years but they didn't do anything to keep everything else from looking totally blown out. In a lot of scenes the skin colors of the characters look pure white. It's super distracting as someone who has seen it before and I know if I adjust my tv settings everything will just look a darker shade of white with the brightness still cranked up. It feels lazy because you can brighten a background while keeping foreground and midground characters consistent with previous grades. I'm not a pro when it comes to restoring/regrading for home media but man it doesn't look good.
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Neverending
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Post by Neverending on May 1, 2022 10:51:11 GMT -5
So I was watching the blu ray today because I wanted to show my kid a scene of the Batmobile and naturally I started watching more of it. I don't know much about the history of this 4k/blu-ray combo that came out a couple years back but man does the whole thing look super brightened up. It really brings out the darker backgrounds that you might have overlooked while watching it over the years but they didn't do anything to keep everything else from looking totally blown out. In a lot of scenes the skin colors of the characters look pure white. It's super distracting as someone who has seen it before and I know if I adjust my tv settings everything will just look a darker shade of white with the brightness still cranked up. It feels lazy because you can brighten a background while keeping foreground and midground characters consistent with previous grades. I'm not a pro when it comes to restoring/regrading for home media but man it doesn't look good. The VCR industry is kept alive by Star Wars and Batman ‘89.
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Post by Dracula on May 1, 2022 12:24:42 GMT -5
So I was watching the blu ray today because I wanted to show my kid a scene of the Batmobile and naturally I started watching more of it. I don't know much about the history of this 4k/blu-ray combo that came out a couple years back but man does the whole thing look super brightened up. It really brings out the darker backgrounds that you might have overlooked while watching it over the years but they didn't do anything to keep everything else from looking totally blown out. In a lot of scenes the skin colors of the characters look pure white. It's super distracting as someone who has seen it before and I know if I adjust my tv settings everything will just look a darker shade of white with the brightness still cranked up. It feels lazy because you can brighten a background while keeping foreground and midground characters consistent with previous grades. I'm not a pro when it comes to restoring/regrading for home media but man it doesn't look good. The release was generally very well received by the home video community. www.blu-ray.com/movies/Batman-4K-Blu-ray/230456/#Reviewultrahd.highdefdigest.com/71558/batman30thanniversaryedition4kultrahdbluray.html
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Post by Neverending on May 2, 2022 1:11:46 GMT -5
So I was watching the blu ray today because I wanted to show my kid a scene of the Batmobile and naturally I started watching more of it. I don't know much about the history of this 4k/blu-ray combo that came out a couple years back but man does the whole thing look super brightened up. It really brings out the darker backgrounds that you might have overlooked while watching it over the years but they didn't do anything to keep everything else from looking totally blown out. In a lot of scenes the skin colors of the characters look pure white. It's super distracting as someone who has seen it before and I know if I adjust my tv settings everything will just look a darker shade of white with the brightness still cranked up. It feels lazy because you can brighten a background while keeping foreground and midground characters consistent with previous grades. I'm not a pro when it comes to restoring/regrading for home media but man it doesn't look good. The release was generally very well received by the home video community. www.blu-ray.com/movies/Batman-4K-Blu-ray/230456/#Reviewultrahd.highdefdigest.com/71558/batman30thanniversaryedition4kultrahdbluray.htmlThey trippin.
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Neverending
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Post by Neverending on Aug 13, 2024 8:45:43 GMT -5
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PG Cooper
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Post by PG Cooper on Aug 13, 2024 15:51:51 GMT -5
I don't think it was intended that the scene be so dark we literally cannot see Vicki's face.
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Post by Neverending on Aug 13, 2024 18:45:02 GMT -5
I don't think it was intended that the scene be so dark we literally cannot see Vicki's face. I see her face just fine. Doomsday saw it in 35mm three or four times and furiously masturbated each time.
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PG Cooper
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Post by PG Cooper on Aug 13, 2024 19:04:59 GMT -5
I don't think it was intended that the scene be so dark we literally cannot see Vicki's face. I see her face just fine. Doomsday saw it in 35mm three or four times and furiously masturbated each time. There are frames that actively look like trash in the video posted. No way that was the intended look.
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Post by Neverending on Aug 13, 2024 19:12:11 GMT -5
There are frames that actively look like trash. It’s 35-year-old footage. It has to be cleaned up and restored. But the point of the scene is that Vicki is trying to get a close look of Batman and he keeps hiding in the shadows. The scene is supposed to be dark.
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Post by PG Cooper on Aug 13, 2024 19:35:23 GMT -5
There are frames that actively look like trash. It’s 35-year-old footage. It has to be cleaned up and restored. But the point of the scene is that Vicki is trying to get a close look of Batman and he keeps hiding in the shadows. The scene is supposed to be dark. In this version it's so dark that Batman moving to hide his face doesn't make sense. There's no need to move when you're cast in that much darkness. We also can't see Basinger even though it's her looks studying Batman driving the scene nor can we see the subtle detail of Keaton's performance.
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Post by Neverending on Aug 13, 2024 20:04:53 GMT -5
it's so dark that Batman moving to hide his face doesn't make sense
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Post by Neverending on Aug 14, 2024 16:36:20 GMT -5
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PG Cooper
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Post by PG Cooper on Aug 14, 2024 16:38:46 GMT -5
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Post by Doomsday on Aug 14, 2024 16:42:32 GMT -5
Why masturbate to Vicki Vale when I can masturbate to Ryan O'Neal?
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Post by Neverending on Aug 14, 2024 17:02:21 GMT -5
Why masturbate to Vicki Vale when I can masturbate to Ryan O'Neal? lol, yeah, that dude got roasted all over Twitter. But they and PG Cooper missed the point. Watch the videos above. The VHS/DVD/Blu-Ray desaturated the colors, but at least the blacks are there and give the scenes their mood. The 4K has a blue tint that kills the vibe and the colors are saturated. The lighting is off in that scene. That 35mm footage is worn out and there’s details missing as a result, but the blacks are black, and looking at Vicki’s sweater, the colors are bold without it being saturated. If we’re talking about intent, that’s how the movie is supposed to look. Blacks. Bold colors (not saturated). No tints. Moody lighting. That 4K is a joke. If you restored that 35mm footage it’d look fantastic. It’s like people that watch a 35mm print of Star Wars and then complain that it’s washed. Yeah, motherfucker, do you know how worn out a Star Wars print from 1977 must be? It’s a miracle it hasn’t caught on fire and turned into ashes. You gotta go the Marty Scorsese route and restore these old prints. A full restored 1989 print of Batman would be fucking amazing.
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