IanTheCool
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Post by IanTheCool on Nov 27, 2016 23:54:16 GMT -5
Why?
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Jibbs
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Post by Jibbs on Nov 28, 2016 0:50:16 GMT -5
Because it introduced a second unrelated sci-fi-ism. It looked at science fiction like a genre that needs a finale fit for itself. Some seem to feel that if an action movie needs a big building blowing up at the end, and a comedy needs a major funny set piece with many characters in confrontation, then a sci-fi film about aliens needs time travel. It just depends if you can buy these two things existing at the same time in what was basically our universe. It doesn't seem to be bothering some. Looper kind of does the same thing. We don't have time travel or telekinesis in our world. It's weird and off-putting.
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IanTheCool
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Post by IanTheCool on Nov 28, 2016 17:25:15 GMT -5
I think its much more integrated than Looper.
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Jibbs
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Post by Jibbs on Nov 28, 2016 19:33:42 GMT -5
Perhaps on a re-watch. However, if it was well integrated, they wouldn't have intentionally deceived us with the "flashbacks." She wasn't 4-dimensional until the aliens gave it to her, correct?
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Neverending
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Post by Neverending on Nov 28, 2016 20:08:09 GMT -5
Because it's random. At least in Interstellar there was a built up to the ending. Here it was just like... okay? It felt like one thing had nothing to do with the other and it made the movie conclude underwhelmingly. I would have preferred the sappy "we saved the world through communication" over whatever the fuck that was.
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IanTheCool
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Post by IanTheCool on Nov 28, 2016 21:23:33 GMT -5
Perhaps on a re-watch. However, if it was well integrated, they wouldn't have intentionally deceived us with the "flashbacks." She wasn't 4-dimensional until the aliens gave it to her, correct? They didn't give it to her directly, she developed it by becoming familiar with their language. She was having the flashes the whole time, she just didnt understand them until the end.
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Neverending
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Post by Neverending on Nov 28, 2016 21:27:22 GMT -5
Perhaps on a re-watch. However, if it was well integrated, they wouldn't have intentionally deceived us with the "flashbacks." She wasn't 4-dimensional until the aliens gave it to her, correct? They didn't give it to her directly, she developed it by becoming familiar with their language. She was having the flashes the whole time, she just didnt understand them until the end. Still... what did one thing have to do with the other? And how did the whole time travel thing make any sense ?
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FShuttari
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Post by FShuttari on Nov 28, 2016 21:43:20 GMT -5
They didn't give it to her directly, she developed it by becoming familiar with their language. She was having the flashes the whole time, she just didnt understand them until the end. Still... what did one thing have to do with the other? And how did the whole time travel thing make any sense ? Exactly! When did she start having these flashbacks, how did she start learning about time travel? When did she start learning and how did she compose the time traveling, with her just learning words and language? None of this is explained in the movie. I feel like, the only reason "Shaymalan Twist" effect was put in for the wow effect, but no thought process was made possible by the movie. Maybe I'm wrong... But that's what I got from the film.
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Jibbs
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Post by Jibbs on Nov 28, 2016 21:50:59 GMT -5
Perhaps on a re-watch. However, if it was well integrated, they wouldn't have intentionally deceived us with the "flashbacks." She wasn't 4-dimensional until the aliens gave it to her, correct? They didn't give it to her directly, she developed it by becoming familiar with their language. She was having the flashes the whole time, she just didnt understand them until the end. The movie opened with one.
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Neverending
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Post by Neverending on Nov 28, 2016 22:00:33 GMT -5
Jibbs already broke down the stupidity of time travel. The real question is how the daughter and aliens were connected. One had nothing to do with the other. The end was just... what? Was there a point to all this? How did we go from communication to whatever the fuck that ending was supposed to be.
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thebtskink
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Post by thebtskink on Nov 28, 2016 22:14:11 GMT -5
They didn't give it to her directly, she developed it by becoming familiar with their language. She was having the flashes the whole time, she just didnt understand them until the end. The movie opened with one. That was her talking about her past, also her chronological past. It wasn't a flash at all, but her talking about her memories. It still fits with when she got the ability.
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Neverending
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Post by Neverending on Nov 28, 2016 22:27:07 GMT -5
Yeah, the whole movie is a Christopher Nolan style non-linear nonsense.
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Post by Dracula on Nov 28, 2016 23:32:46 GMT -5
They didn't give it to her directly, she developed it by becoming familiar with their language. She was having the flashes the whole time, she just didnt understand them until the end. The movie opened with one. The movie is told in the form of memories, except that her memories go forward and backward. When she "thinks in English" the movie plays out like a conventional story, when she starts "thinking in Cephalopod" we get the flashes. In her mind the fact that the daughter dies after the main story instead of before is irrelevant.
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Jibbs
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Post by Jibbs on Nov 29, 2016 0:01:44 GMT -5
I understand the logic of the flashes, but you can't deny there is an early one set right near a concerned phone call from her mother that puts the idea in our head that this has already happened. And it's still before she met them. She can't think like a Cephalopod, yet. (And don't tell me she can retroactively because of the power she WILL get, because that's a can of worms.)
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Dracula
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Post by Dracula on Nov 29, 2016 6:38:57 GMT -5
I understand the logic of the flashes, but you can't deny there is an early one set right near a concerned phone call from her mother that puts the idea in our head that this has already happened. And it's still before she met them. She can't think like a Cephalopod, yet. (And don't tell me she can retroactively because of the power she WILL get, because that's a can of worms.) I would suggest that she isn't flashing forward in that scene at the beginning, that that's actually where the movie starts chronologically and the rest of it is the flashback.
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Deexan
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Post by Deexan on Dec 2, 2016 17:46:07 GMT -5
We just don't get it because we're 3 dimensional beings.
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Deexan
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Post by Deexan on Dec 2, 2016 17:46:40 GMT -5
5 dimensional entities are laughing at us right now.
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Neverending
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Post by Neverending on Dec 2, 2016 18:15:41 GMT -5
We just don't get it because we're 3 dimensional beings. 5 dimensional entities are laughing at us right now. We get it. We just don't like it. See: Interstellar
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SnoBorderZero
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Post by SnoBorderZero on Dec 2, 2016 22:17:06 GMT -5
Even if you don't love the reveal at the end, you can't deny that this film's score, editing, cinematography, and direction were really strong. Reminded me of Upstream Color where the editing became such a sensory experience for the viewer, very immersive and striking.
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Jibbs
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Post by Jibbs on Dec 2, 2016 23:07:59 GMT -5
Who's denying it? If those things were crap, I wouldn't care what happened at the end.
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SnoBorderZero
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Post by SnoBorderZero on Dec 4, 2016 14:23:21 GMT -5
I guess I meant more that when the reveal happened I wasn't blown away but I wasn't so put off it by it either because the film was so effective throughout in taking the viewer on a very sensory and emotional ride due to the fantastic editing and music. Is it what keeps the film from achieving greatness? Maybe, but it wasn't a deal breaker for me either.
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Neverending
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Post by Neverending on Dec 4, 2016 15:09:57 GMT -5
I guess I meant more that when the reveal happened I wasn't blown away but I wasn't so put off it by it either because the film was so effective throughout in taking the viewer on a very sensory and emotional ride due to the fantastic editing and music. Is it what keeps the film from achieving greatness? Maybe, but it wasn't a deal breaker for me either. The flashbacks/flashforwards were distracting in general. The movie starts with her daughter and you think it's just character building stuff. Then her daughter kept coming back and you realize there's more to it. My attention was divided between getting invested in the main story and waiting for a twist to happen. If the daughter had vanished till the end, you're right, you can forgive the silly twist. But since they've kept preparing the audience for it, the entire ending felt like a major disappointment and kinda ruined the movie. Interstellar, flawed as it may have been, at least had a built up to the ending. You weren't distracted by the anticipation for the twist. You were just going along the journey. Christopher Nolan > Denis French Canadian Batman > Blade Runner 2029
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Post by Dracula on Dec 4, 2016 15:28:06 GMT -5
I guess I meant more that when the reveal happened I wasn't blown away but I wasn't so put off it by it either because the film was so effective throughout in taking the viewer on a very sensory and emotional ride due to the fantastic editing and music. Is it what keeps the film from achieving greatness? Maybe, but it wasn't a deal breaker for me either. The flashbacks/flashforwards were distracting in general. The movie starts with her daughter and you think it's just character building stuff. Then her daughter kept coming back and you realize there's more to it. My attention was divided between getting invested in the main story and waiting for a twist to happen. If the daughter had vanished till the end, you're right, you can forgive the silly twist. But since they've kept preparing the audience for it, the entire ending felt like a major disappointment and kinda ruined the movie. Interstellar, flawed as it may have been, at least had a built up to the ending. You weren't distracted by the anticipation for the twist. You were just going along the journey. Christopher Nolan > Denis French Canadian Batman > Blade Runner 2029 Notice how the second I like a Denis Villeneuve movie Neverending throws him under the bus...
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Post by daniel on Dec 5, 2016 17:00:40 GMT -5
9/10
I like movies that make me engage my brain once in a while. The little tidbits, the in-your-face foreshadowing on the helicopter ride at the beginning that makes sense once you realize how time works, etc., was all very well-crafted. Best film of the year thusfar, for me.
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Post by Neverending on Dec 5, 2016 17:46:37 GMT -5
9/10 I like movies that make me engage my brain once in a while. The little tidbits, the in-your-face foreshadowing on the helicopter ride at the beginning that makes sense once you realize how time works, etc., was all very well-crafted. Best film of the year thusfar, for me. The best movie of the year is Mr. Right, written by your pal, Max Landis.
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