Dracula
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Post by Dracula on Oct 18, 2014 16:56:30 GMT -5
Fatal Attraction should have won. Dracula hates it but the rest of the world loved it. It's an alright movie for 90 minutes and then descends into abject stupidity in the ending. If it had kept the original ending it might have been somewhat respectable. As released it isn't.
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PG Cooper
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Post by PG Cooper on Oct 19, 2014 10:02:00 GMT -5
I'd have gone with Full Metal Jacket, but again, haven't seen The Last Emperor.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2014 10:10:19 GMT -5
I prefer The Last Emperor. Full Metal Jacket is impressive on the first viewing, then it quickly loses value when you realize how hollow it is.
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Dracula
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Post by Dracula on Oct 19, 2014 10:33:36 GMT -5
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Jibbs
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Post by Jibbs on Oct 19, 2014 10:47:50 GMT -5
Is this in the right thread?
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PG Cooper
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Post by PG Cooper on Oct 19, 2014 11:02:07 GMT -5
Of course. Dracula is putting Oculus forth as an early Oscar contender.
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Post by Jibbs on Oct 19, 2014 13:32:50 GMT -5
I was afraid of that.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2014 13:36:07 GMT -5
Drac-bot is malfunctioning.
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Jibbs
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Post by Jibbs on Oct 19, 2014 14:30:05 GMT -5
There's still some bugs after the transfer to the new boards. We'll get him working soon.
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Post by Neverending on Oct 19, 2014 14:39:39 GMT -5
I'd have gone with Full Metal Jacket, but again, haven't seen The Last Emperor. Full Metal Jacket wasn't nominated. The nominees for Best Picture were: Broadcast News (James L. Brooks) Fatal Attraction Hope & Glory (John Boorman) The Last Emperor Moonstruck (Cher / Nicolas Cage) Of those nominees, the obvious winner is Fatal Attraction. You can make arguments for Broadcast News and Moonstruck, but no other adult movie captured America's imagination quite like Fatal Attraction. That movie was HUGE and launched the erotic thriller genre of the late 1980's and early 1990's. It made a much bigger impact than The Last Emperor, a movie that most people forgot about.
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Dracula
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Post by Dracula on Oct 19, 2014 15:23:34 GMT -5
I'd have gone with Full Metal Jacket, but again, haven't seen The Last Emperor. Full Metal Jacket wasn't nominated. The nominees for Best Picture were: Broadcast News (James L. Brooks) Fatal Attraction Hope & Glory (John Boorman) The Last Emperor Moonstruck (Cher / Nicolas Cage) Of those nominees, the obvious winner is Fatal Attraction. You can make arguments for Broadcast News and Moonstruck, but no other adult movie captured America's imagination quite like Fatal Attraction. That movie was HUGE and launched the erotic thriller genre of the late 1980's and early 1990's. It made a much bigger impact than The Last Emperor, a movie that most people forgot about. Being popular does not equal being great and worthy. Most people learn that in high school. The Oscars are supposed to be about artistic merit and Fatal Attraction has very little. The Last Emperor isn't necessarily something I'd consider a masterpiece, but it's certainly better than the other four choices and if most people forget about it that's their loss.
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Post by Neverending on Oct 19, 2014 16:38:12 GMT -5
The Last Emperor is a movie that most people forgot about. Their loss. Great movies are not forgotten. Even when they're ignored upon release they manage to find an audience. See, your problem is that you care too much about artistic integrity. When the Academy thinks like you, that's when movies like The King's Speech and The Artist win. The best movies emotionally connect with an audience, regardless of whether they're artistic or not. You claim that every movie should try to be a masterpiece. Well, every movie that IS a masterpiece cared about its audience feelings. What should they feel in this scene? What should they feel for this character? So for a movie to succeed in bonding with the audience should be rewarded. And when the Academy thinks like me, that's when movies like The Godfather and Rocky win. Fatal Attraction wasn't simply popular. It made an impact. And it wasn't even the best movie of 1987. The better movies, the ones that made a deeper impact, weren't even recognized. Where's The Untouchables? Where's Full Metal Jacket? Heck, where's Lethal Weapon or Robocop? So for Fatal Attraction to actually get recognition is a major victory. And then, for it to get b---h slapped by a movie that no one cared about - except for Doomsday apparently - it is an insult to Fatal Attraction and every movie that wasn't acknowledged.
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PG Cooper
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Post by PG Cooper on Oct 19, 2014 17:25:42 GMT -5
Full Metal Jacket wasn't nominated. I know, but it should have been. Granted, I've only seen two of the nominees from that year (Fatal Attraction and Moonstruck) but Full Metal Jacket is a hell of a lot better than both of those. Great movies are not forgotten. Sometimes they are.
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Post by Jibbs on Oct 19, 2014 17:37:52 GMT -5
Great movies are not forgotten. Even when they're ignored upon release they manage to find an audience. See, your problem is that you care too much about artistic integrity. When the Academy thinks like you, that's when movies like The King's Speech and The Artist win. The best movies emotionally connect with an audience, regardless of whether they're artistic or not. You claim that every movie should try to be a masterpiece. Well, every movie that IS a masterpiece cared about its audience feelings. What should they feel in this scene? What should they feel for this character? So for a movie to succeed in bonding with the audience should be rewarded. And when the Academy thinks like me, that's when movies like The Godfather and Rocky win. Fatal Attraction wasn't simply popular. It made an impact. And it wasn't even the best movie of 1987. The better movies, the ones that made a deeper impact, weren't even recognized. Where's The Untouchables? Where's Full Metal Jacket? Heck, where's Lethal Weapon or Robocop? So for Fatal Attraction to actually get recognition is a major victory. And then, for it to get b---h slapped by a movie that no one cared about - except for Doomsday apparently - it is an insult to Fatal Attraction and every movie that wasn't acknowledged. Don't forget that the Oscar, the actual statuette and award, go to the filmmakers.
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Dracula
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Post by Dracula on Oct 19, 2014 17:59:28 GMT -5
Great movies are not forgotten. Even when they're ignored upon release they manage to find an audience. See, your problem is that you care too much about artistic integrity. When the Academy thinks like you, that's when movies like The King's Speech and The Artist win. What are you talking about? The King's Speech is a perfect example of the Academy letting their emotions getting the best of them. They voted for it because the story of the rich king overcoming his "adversity" was "inspiring." Hell, Harvey Weinstein's campaign slogan was literally "some movies you feel." And so, they voted for the mediocre middlebrow bullshit devoid of substantial artistry. More or less the same thing with The Artist. Fatal Attraction wasn't simply popular. It made an impact. And it wasn't even the best movie of 1987. The better movies, the ones that made a deeper impact, weren't even recognized. Where's The Untouchables? Where's Full Metal Jacket? Heck, where's Lethal Weapon or Robocop? I'll grant you, that was a shitty year and the pickings were slim. But, let's not over-exagerate how impactful Fatal Attraction was. Yes, it was popular. It was the second highest grossing movie of the year behind... Three Men and a Baby (BTW, really?). And yes it got people talking, but it also isn't good. Movies that fall apart at the end like that don't deserve awards. Period. The has to be some standards, you don't just hand the award to whatever the public is stupid enough to rush to. And was it really that impactful? Yes, it inspired a lot of similar schlock to be made for a couple of years (I've been watching a number of the imitators this month, they're nothing to be proud of) but that doesn't mean it really mattered much in the grand scheme of things and I don't know that it's really all that much more remembered today really. And then, for it to get b---h slapped by a movie that no one cared about - except for Doomsday apparently - it is an insult to Fatal Attraction and every movie that wasn't acknowledged. Who's to say no one cares about it? It's in the Criterion Collection and it's seen as an important installment of Bernardo Bertolucci's oeuvre. Fatal Attraction, by contrast is mostly just seen as a dated 80s artifact.
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Post by Neverending on Oct 19, 2014 18:09:43 GMT -5
Not at all. The King's Speech is an example of the Oscars being too chicken to vote for Toy Story 3 or Inception. Because, you know, they're popular - and if high school taught us anything - popularity means nothing.
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Post by Dracula on Oct 19, 2014 18:27:18 GMT -5
Not at all. The King's Speech is an example of the Oscars being too chicken to vote for Toy Story 3 or Inception. Because, you know, they're popular - and if high school taught us anything - popularity means nothing. Those weren't the front runners that year. It was a race between The Kings Speech (the feel good populist Rocky story about millionaires overcoming the odds) vs. The Social Network (the meticulously crafted rumination on the costs of success and the dark side of the internet) and they went with the more popular choice.
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Post by Neverending on Oct 19, 2014 18:52:30 GMT -5
The King's Speech wasn't even in the conversation till after the Golden Globes when Harvey Weinstein's quintessential campaigning went into high gear. Most Oscar voters even admitted that they didn't care about the movie. Weinstein simply slipped a few favors under the table. The Social Network was definitely the movie people wanted to vote for, but even then, they weren't doing it for the right reasons. Inception and Toy Story 3 are, by far, the movies that have resonated the most in the last four years. You're lying to yourself if you say they aren't. Even I, who chose Black Swan, will admit that those two have had a greater lasting impression and I've had to re-evaluate them in recent years. Inception especially, which you may recall, I was a bit harsh on because Christopher Nolan's over-explaining of everything is ridiculous. In hindsight, however, Inception and Toy Story 3 should have been the frontrunners with Inception being the obvious winner. But the Academy would never even dare to consider them because they're not "artistic" enough. Like you, they put "art" over the emotional bond between a movie and an audience. And keep in mind that audiences did not care about The King's Speech. So to even imply that is ludicrous. The same goes with The Artist. Audiences loved Black Swan, Toy Story 3, Inception, The Fighter and The Social Network. And in that order.
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Post by PG Cooper on Oct 19, 2014 19:42:42 GMT -5
In hindsight, however, Inception and Toy Story 3 should have been the frontrunners with Inception being the obvious winner. But the Academy would never even dare to consider them because they're not "artistic" enough. Like you, they put "art" over the emotional bond between a movie and an audience. Wasn't Dracula's number one film that year Inception?
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Dracula
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Post by Dracula on Oct 19, 2014 20:11:40 GMT -5
The King's Speech wasn't even in the conversation till after the Golden Globes when Harvey Weinstein's quintessential campaigning went into high gear. Most Oscar voters even admitted that they didn't care about the movie. That is categorically untrue. The movie was "in the conversation" before anyone saw it and was considered a front runner as soon as it premiered at Telluride and Toronto and won the Audience choice award. The Social Network was definitely the movie people wanted to vote for, but even then, they weren't doing it for the right reasons. If they'd wanted to vote for The Social Network they would have done it. Politics does obviously play a role in the Oscars but to suggest that Harvey Weinstein can make people vote for a movie they actively don't want to is tinfoil hat thinking. Inception and Toy Story 3 are, by far, the movies that have resonated the most in the last four years. You're lying to yourself if you say they aren't. Even I, who chose Black Swan, will admit that those two have had a greater lasting impression and I've had to re-evaluate them in recent years. Inception especially, which you may recall, I was a bit harsh on because Christopher Nolan's over-explaining of everything is ridiculous. In hindsight, however, Inception and Toy Story 3 should have been the frontrunners with Inception being the obvious winner. Look, I liked Inception as much as anyone, you can look back at The Golden Stakes from that year and you'll see it was the number one film for me at the time. I would have been thrilled if the Academy had chosen it. However, I didn't want them to do that just because it happened to be one of the year's most popular films, I wanted them to do it because I legitimately thought it was an award-worthy achievement and an artistic breakthrough. And keep in mind that audiences did not care about The King's Speech. So to even imply that is ludicrous. The same goes with The Artist. Audiences loved Black Swan, Toy Story 3, Inception, The Fighter and The Social Network. And in that order. Audiences LOVED The King's Speech... at least audiences of a certain age. It made $138 millions dollars domestic, $414 million worldwide. It outgrossed The Fighter, it outgrossed The Social Netword, it outgrossed Black Swan, and worldwide it outgrossed True Grit. They ate it up it because it's a simplistic heartstring pulling movie that aimed to please audiences and give them what they wanted. In other words, it's everything that you describe as greatness.
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Post by Neverending on Oct 20, 2014 2:33:08 GMT -5
I don't know where you pulled that quote from. I was trashing The King's Speech from day one.
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Post by Deexan on Oct 20, 2014 7:20:54 GMT -5
Fatal Attraction is good for a teenage wank and not much else.
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Post by Dracula on Oct 20, 2014 8:58:37 GMT -5
I don't know where you pulled that quote from. I was trashing The King's Speech from day one. Doing quotes on this site is a finicky finicky process. That was supposed to be my response to something by somehow it ended up in you're quote bubble. It's fixed.
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Post by Neverending on Oct 20, 2014 13:49:33 GMT -5
OSCAR REWIND: 10 MOVIES & ARTISTS CELEBRATING BIG ANNIVERSARIES THIS YEAR! #10 - LORD OF THE RINGS WINS BEST PICTURE!A fantasy-adventure film that is very mainstream and a box office sensation almost never wins a "respectable" Academy Award but it happened 10 years ago when Peter Jackson's adaptation of The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King won 11 Academy Awards including Best Picture. As someone who was online on that night, I can vividly remember the excitement of every geek and nerd on the planet. Even if you didn't give a s--t about LOTR it was still amazing to see the Oscars FINALLY loosen up and reward a crowd-pleasing film. The lone exception to all this was our board moderator, Doomsday, who proclaimed that LOTR had a 0% chance of winning Best Picture and he never heard the end of it till CS! became a Mad Max wasteland. #9 - THE COPPOLA FAMILY ADDS ANOTHER OSCAR TO THEIR COLLECTIONFrancis Ford Coppola has won several Academy Awards. His father, Carmine Coppola, won an Oscar for The Godfather, Part II. His nephew, Nicolas Cage, won an Oscar for Leaving Las Vegas. And 10 years ago, his daughter Sofia Coppola, won an Oscar for Lost In Translation. Meanwhile, other members of his family have received Academy Award nominations. So if you're part of the Coppola clan and have gotten no Oscar love whatsoever, I feel really bad for you. #8 - STEVEN SPIELBERG FINALLY WINS AN ACADEMY AWARD!Throughout the late 1970's and 1980's, Steven Spielberg was disrespected by the Academy Awards on several occasions. He did not receive a Best Director nomination for Jaws, which is insane, and The Color Purple infamously lost in every single category despite getting 11 nominations. So when Schindler's List became a contender 20 years ago, everyone knew it had to win Best Picture and Best Director. Schindler's List is a legitimately great movie and Spielberg was long overdue. #7 - TOM HANKS WINS HIS FIRST OSCAR FOR PHILADELPHIA Last year, I had fun comparing and contrasting different Oscar ceremonies and this year is no exception. Especially when you consider the people and movies involved. This year, many people were upset that Tom Hanks didn't receive a Best Actor nomination for Captain Phillips. Meanwhile, the front runner is the category is Matthew McConaughey for playing a gay man with AIDS in Dallas Buyers Club. So it is very fascinating to point out that 20 years ago, Tom Hanks won the first of two Oscars in a row for playing a gay man with AIDS in the court room drama, Philadelphia. It's always amusing when history repeats itself. Let's hope McConaughey wins an Oscar next year for playing a mentally handicapped person. Speaking of which... #6 - DUSTIN HOFFMAN WINS HIS SECOND OSCAR FOR RAIN MAN; BEATS GENE HACKMANIn the 1950's, Dustin Hoffman and Gene Hackman were classmates in acting school and they were infamously voted least likely to succeed by the other students. Then in 1967, they had the last laugh by receiving Academy Award nominations for The Graduate and Bonnie & Clyde which were two groundbreaking Hollywood films. Fast-forward to 1989, and they're the two frontrunners for Best Actor at the Oscars. Hoffman delivered a brilliant, although cliche performance, in Rain Man while Hackman brought out his inner Popeye Doyle for a very badass performance in Mississippi Burning. Hoffman would, of course, win because the Oscars love rewarding actors that portray mentally handicapped people. #5 - PIXAR WINS ITS FIRST OSCARBefore Pixar was the most successful animation studio in the world, it was just a visual effects company that George Lucas sold to Steve Jobs. But the head of the creative department, John Lasseter, believed the company could evolve into a powerhouse in the animation industry and he proved his point in 1988 with Tin Toy. It won the Oscar for Best Animated Short Film and became the first CGI movie to win anything. #4 - THE OSCARS STREAKERHas it really been 40 years since a hippie streaked at the Oscars? Has it really been 40 years since David Niven made a penis joke at the Oscars? Man, time flies. At least that's what I assume Ramplate would say. I wasn't even alive in 1974 but it's good to know crazy s--t was happening at the Oscars before I was born. And I'm sure crazy s--t will continue after I'm gone. #3 - TATUM O'NEAL WINS AN OSCAR!Whenever a child is nominated for an Oscar, certain people get upset. Now imagine when a child WINS an Academy Award. It happened 20 years ago with Anna Paquin in The Piano but the most noteworthy winner was Tatum O'Neal 40 years ago. Why? Well, because she beat another child who was also nominated that year. I'm, of course, talking about Linda Blair in The Exorcist. Can you imagine two child actors nominated in the same category and they're both the frontrunners? If that happened today, Dracula would literally kill himself. #2 - STANLEY KUBRICK WINS HIS ONLY OSCAR!In a year where Alfonso Cuaron's Gravity is a major contender at the Academy Awards, it is important to remember that 45 years ago, Stanley Kubrick won his ONLY Oscar for 2001: A Space Odyssey. And it wasn't for Best Picture, Best Director or even Best Screenplay. He won the award for Best Special Effects. I kid you not. Stanley Kubrick's only Academy Award was for a technical category. Granted, the special effects in 2001 were groundbreaking and he deserved to win but it's amusing that his only recognition by the Academy in a competitive category (meaning no tribute awards) was for his technical skills. #1 - SIDNEY POITIER WINS HISTORIC OSCAR!In a year where 12 Years a Slave might win Best Picture, it's important to remember that 50 years ago - half a century ago - Sidney Poitier became the first African-American to win Best Actor. Since him, only Denzel Washington and Jamie Foxx have won in that category. People have never accused the Oscars of being racially diverse.
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Post by Neverending on Oct 20, 2014 14:12:24 GMT -5
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